THSCC Forums

Somewhat of a self-serving question here...

Right now I'm the only SO2 car registered. There are a gaggle of SU2 and SO4 entries. I can understand SO4 being separate, since the performance differential is so large... But SO2? Most cars over 2.4l can't use any of the extra grunt anyways.

Maybe it would make more sense to separate the 2WD cars based on prep level? Or Front vs. RWD?

Just tossing some ideas out there, and lamenting the lack of competition in SO2, since light, cheap, FWD econoboxes seem to be the car of choice for this sport! SU2 is also a very large class, it might make sense to find a good way to split it.

(Dare I suggest: SS2 = stock 2WD, SM2 = modified 2WD? How about SS2 uses the SOLO Street Prepared ruleset, and anything beyond that lands you in SM2?)

Flame away

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Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

Mike, I thought the S02 class was to protect those cars from the SU2 cars!

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In need of car.

How about we go ahead and run the SCCA classes, like we do with autox? Carl & I had hesitated to suggest this for rallyx yet, since our program is so new & everybody is just out to have fun, it seems. But then if everybody is just out to have fun, it doesn't matter what the classes are...

Carl, you reading this?

I don't care. Just let me drive. I'll be DFL anyways

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www.ncvw.org
1993 VW Corrado VR6 - DSP15 (RIP)
1986 MB 190E 2.3L 16v - STX (SOLD)
1997 BMW M3 3.2L - BS for now

mike, if you're looking for some SO2 competition i'd be willing to codrive the e30

from the scca RallyCross rules:


"3.2 VEHICLE CLASSIFICATION

NOTE: Regions and divisions may specify local rules providing
they are clearly described and that event organizers realize that
a dual-scoring system must be used to score events both for
local points and for divisional and national championships
(when applicable).
RallyCross championship points will be awarded in the following
classes:
Note* all items that are not specifically allowed or referred to as
unrestricted must be of original manufacturer’s specification.
A. Rear Wheel Drive Street Stock 2 wheel drive-SSR
Front Wheel Drive Street Stock 2 wheel drive-SSF
All Wheel Drive Street Stock-SSA
In the Street Stock 2 and 4 wheel drive classes
1. All Cars must be equipped as came from the manufacturer,
with only factory-installed and port-installed option packages.
Options that were only part of a package must be present with
the entire package. Complete option packages may be installed
after purchase of the vehicle.
2. Tire must be unmodified DOT approved. Snow tires are
legal. Tires may not interfere with any parts of the car (fenders,
fender liners, suspension, etc)
3. Wheel diameter, width, and offset are free
4. The additions of protective equipment is allowed with the
following exceptions.
a. The modifications must only provide protection to the
car and/or occupants and provide no performance
advantage.
b. Mudflaps and underbody chassis protection may only
be made of urethane and other plastic derivatives (i.e. no
carbon-kevlar)
c. Skidplates protecting suspension and drivetrain
9
components may only be made out of metal or plastic
derivatives.
d. Driver restraints and roll cage may be added.
Sunroofs may be fixed shut.
e. Additional or replacement hood and trunk latches are
permitted. All latch systems must be secures.
5. Dress-up and convenience items which do not five a
performance advantage or reduce the weith of the car or
weigh less than the standard part they are replacing are
allowed.
6. ABS and/or traction control systems may be electronically
disabled but not removed.
7. Vehicle lights may be replaced with alternate bulbs and
housing. Auxiliary lights may be added. The total
number of lights shall not be less than as standard.
8. Rally Street Rear Wheel Drive-RSR
Rally Street Front Wheel Drive-RSF
Rally Street All Wheel Drive-RSA
1. All Street Stock class modifications are allowed.
2. Swaybars and their mounting are free.
3. Brake pads and shoes are free. Rotors must remain
stock. Flexible rubber lines may be replaced by alternate
lines, including braided metal lines.
4. Exhaust systems from the most downstream catalytic
converter back are free with the following exceptions:
a. The exhaust must exit the body work.
b. The exhaust must exit to the rear of the driver.
c. The exhaust must comply with the noise restrictions.
5. The intake system upstream from the throttle body is free.
Under no circumstances may forced induction
components be changed (turbochargers, superchargers,
intercoolers).
6. Shift knobs, short shift kits and pedal covers are allowed.
7. Front and/or rear strut tower bars are permitted.
8. Shocks are free but the shock/strut must mount to the
original mounting position using unmodified mounting
points.
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Rally Prepared Two Wheel Drive-RP2
Rally Prepared All Wheel Drive-RP4
1. All allowances from Rally Street are allowed.
2. Any tire is allowed.
3. Any spring of the same type (i.e. coil, leaf, etc.) as
standard is permitted. Length and rate are free.
Threaded collars and camber plates are allowed.
4. Electronic engine control may be modified using piggyback
style computers, replacement or modified ECU’s, or
full stand-alone systems. This specifically allows
changes to fuel mapping, ignition timing. And boost
levels.
5. Brakes are free except no carbon brakes allowed.
6. Any replacement hood may be used.
7. Exhaust from the ports back is free with the following
exceptions:
a. The exhaust must exit the body work.
b. The exhaust must exit to the rear of the driver.
c. The exhaust must comply with noise restrictions.
d. Downstream there must be at least one functioning
catalytic converter in the exhaust stream.
8. The clutch is free.
9. Seats are free but must be solidly mounted. All seats
may be removed or replaced.
10. Any car that is currently legal for stage rally competition
in other sanctioning bodies can run in it’s appropriate
Rally Prepared class regardless of whether it meets the
Rally Prepared rules.
D. Open Two Wheel Drive-Rally Mod-RM2
Open All Wheel Drive-Rally Mod-RM4
1. All allowances from Rally Prepated are allowed.
2. Engines are free but must be internal combustion.
3. Drivetrain is free.
4. The suspension is free this allows changes to all
components and geometry.
5. Brake cylinders, number, type and dimensions, are free,
as are all lines.
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6. Body work may be added or substituted with any
material.
7. The interior may be completely stripped and/or replaced.
8. Additional chassis braces and seam-welding are
permitted.
9. All logbooked race cars that meet entry requirements are
legal for the proper Open class.
10. The fuel system is free provided unleaded fuel is used.
11. Glass, with the exception of the front windshield, may be
replaced with lexan or equivalent."

Bleh!

Simple rules I say. how about all 2wd in one class and all 4wd in another, with all logbooked rally cars stuck in the 4wd class no matter their drive layout?

--Kevin H.

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2003 WRX (again!)

Double Bleh!

We already got our fancy shmancy SU2 Vinyl stickers made up for the General. I think the SCCA Rallycross classifications are a little too much for the level we are currently at. I agree with the "just out there to have fun" comments that have been made. Looking over the results, the RWD's have never beat the FWD 1st place times, so if anything, just lump the 2WD's together if you really want some more competition. As far as the separating the FWDs go.....does anyone really have any performance modifications done to their cars placing them at a significant advantage? We basically have completely stock cars, and completely gutted cars. Are the completely gutted cars really at a true advantage (before you answer that....I offer anyone a run in the General). I think the people that have done well in the "gutted" cars have won because of their skills, not the cars capabilities (or lack thereof).

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Stephen Westerfield
2009 Infiniti M35 | 2007 Honda Fit Sport | 2005 Ford Mustang GT |2000 GMC Sierra |1992 Acura Integra LS | Super Westerfield Bros Acura Integra

Well, can someone tell me what the SCCA classes are? So far as I can see, each SCCA region decides their own classes, and they vary somewhat across the country. (edit: I see Kevin has found and posted them.)

I picked the WDCR-SCCA classes, since I thought we might get some crossover entries in both directions. They've since simplified their classes, I believe, to combine SU2 and SO2 into S2, and the other classes also lost their Us and Os. I'm sure they also discovered that SU2 cars were as fast, if not faster, than the SO2s.

The big thing is tires- specifically "street tires" vs. rally or other knobby tires. Everything else (with the exception of 4WD) seems to fall within the time spread within a class. My feeling was that displacement would be a better arbitrary division than suspension prep level, which seems like the other natural choice. Plus, with almost everyone running stock suspension, it wouldn't solve our class imbalance either. We could divide by FWD/RWD among the 2s, and that might be a fun one, though I think a well-driven RWD car can be as fast as FWD on dirt, we just haven't had one yet.

Basically, it comes back to needing a site that will support the use of rally tires. If we had that, I think our "big 2" classes would probably divide themselves into 4 pretty good ones.

In the meantime, there's easy pickin' in SO2 class for you folks who always wanted a trophy!

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Carl Fisher

Be Cool to the Pizza Dude:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... Id=4651531

Well, being one of the ONLY SO2 people out there ... I would 100% support combining SO2 and SU2, even though that means I will soundly be trounced all year long by the corolla and sentra!

Before or after this event, announced or not, don't matter to me.

Mike <-- wants to be in a big class

_________________
Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

Dude, you just left a big class!

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Carl Fisher

Be Cool to the Pizza Dude:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... Id=4651531

Carl Fisher wrote

Mike was that a slam?

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George Bright Member # 141
One of the youngest of the old farts.
Yes I voted against you joining the club.

First off, I'll admit to not reading 5 words of the rules list above.

Second, if I were to show up at an event-not tomorrow but sometime this year-in a slow, tired, beat-up 4x4 pick-up would I be able to run? Specifically I have a Chebby S-10 4.3 that's still slogging along and I thought it'd be fun to run an event in it.

So what's the word, trucks or no trucks?

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'99 Mk IV Jetta VR6 now claimed by the better half.

'90 Miata A-package, Floats like a butterfly and buzzes like a BEE with loudspeakers.

Trucks are allowed unless they're really jacked up. The main thing is will the tires the tires pass our "Street Tire" rule. And for that, friend, you going to need to read some rules.

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Carl Fisher

Be Cool to the Pizza Dude:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... Id=4651531

Andrew Havas springs to mind. He trounced FWD **AND** AWD cars up and down this coast and into Canada a couple years ago on the ProRally circuit in a heavily modified first gen RX-7. The dude was top ten often in that car.

Anders

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Lina Racing: As Seen On Radio