THSCC Forums

Looking for brake pad recommendations -- something that will be great for daily driving and good enough for the occasional track school. Currently using EBC Green Stuff and I like that they keep the wheels clean. Anything comparable or better to consider? Thanks.

BTW, they'd be going on an E36 M3.

i keep hearing good things about the Porterfield R4-S for daily/autox/moderate track use. i'll be going w/ these next year probably

p.s. i also hear theyre really good on dust and are not noisy on the street

Check with club sponsor Carbotech. I run their Bob Cats on the Miata for street and autox. They are a great set of pads IMHO. The first thing my co-driver at NCAC said after his first run was "great brakes!". I tried the Bob Cats for my first HPDE and found myself wanting for better braking by my third session on the 1st day.

I am currently using their XP9's for track. Awesome "whoa" power in a short distance and so far are not destroying rotors.

KB

_________________
“I feel safer on a racetrack than I do on Houston's freeways.” - A.J. Foyt

Kevin Butler
Mobetta Autosport Spec E30 #612
2003 C5 Z06 Corvette
AFR Miata, SM2 61, '93 w/200 SC'd RWHP - soon to be resurrected
Waaaay too many other projects....

I have no experience with the EBCs. I use Hawk HPS on my M3. Great bite and very little dust. For a green group (first time on track), the EBC or the Hawks or any other metallic "performance" pad will probably work fine, but you may see accelerated wear. Bimmerworld has the best Hawk prices around.

For your 2nd event and until you're in Yellow, I'd recommend OEM Pagids or some other TUV approved OEM quality pads (can't remember the suppliers off the top of my head). Axxis Ultimates would probably do fine also. I'd stay away from MetalMasters if they still make those. Kendra ran on Pagids in yellow group in her 325i without any braking problems at all and I would expect the same on an M3. They all dust like mad but work great on track as long as you aren't going 9/10th for 20 minutes at a time. Then they will fade. OE pads can be had from Black Forest for cheap. Totally streetable too.

When you get really fast (later yellow/blue/instructor groups), any of the dedicated track pads will probably work nicely -- plan to change them for the track. Check back with us then Plenty of options - Hawk, Carbotech, etc.

PS - I haven't evaluated all the options out there nor am I an expert on the M3, but I think these recommendations are sound!

_________________
Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

EBC - Yikes. Not good for actual hard driving on track. Especially if your car is heavy.

R4-S - I killed a set of these on my Miata at Watkins Glen in one weekend.

There really isn't a great dual-duty pad. Go ahead and take the 10 minutes to change the pads once you get to the track to a good track pad. You'll save yourself a lot of frustration in the long run.

I get several weekends out of Carbotech stuff, and almost a season out of Hawk Blues.

Good luck.

_________________
Diane (Hall) Bundas
1992 Spec Miata #48 - 1997 Chevy Tahoe - 2007 Honda Civic Coupe

I disagree. For a novice level driver in a BMW, the Pagids and other OE pads make for a GREAT dual purpose pad.

I did my first event on R4S at Roebling and they were fine. But the price isn't justified over the Pagids.

Plenty of fast drivers in fast groups running flat-out can kill pads easy. But that just doesn't happen in green group where traffic abounds. Just a 4 second/lap difference in time can mean the difference in street pads working great versus melting.

_________________
Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

He didn't say he was a novice/green group drive and I didn't assume.

Novice/first shool... take any pad you want.

My guy in an Audi S4 Quattro at his 3rd school had crappy luck with the EBC Green Stuff. Was fading midway through 20 minute sessions and NHIS isn't horrible on brakes.

_________________
Diane (Hall) Bundas
1992 Spec Miata #48 - 1997 Chevy Tahoe - 2007 Honda Civic Coupe

My experience has been that the Hawk HP+ is the most solid and reliable dual purpose pad you can buy. While not cheap and not perfect, it can take a fair amount of heat and, more importantly and in contrast to many others, doesn't simply melt away or disintegrate if you surpass its usable heat range. The problem with every pad that Mike has mentioned is that the session you start using more brake than you have before, those pads die a quick and nasty death. The HP+ allows you a cushion.

The trade offs are

1. Dust - but since OE BMW pads have been mention, there are certainly no worse than those soot factories.
2. Dust - mentioned again because unlike many other pads, the high met content of the HP+ makes it harder to clean.
3. Noise - they do squeak and squeal, particularly on humid days.
4. Cold performance - they do not have very strong initial bite on very cold days. You must be aware of this if you live at the top of a hill like I do.

The PFC Z pad is another good, dual purpose choice, but I do not think it offers as good high temp wear. Lifetime warranty from AutoZone is a nice feature if you are on a budget.

Neither pad is a substitute for real race pads or real race brakes.

_________________
Rich
http://www.v8mongrel.com/

Novice is right -- I should have mentioned it.

A little more detail: The pads would be used primarily on the street -- I probably will not be doing more than 3-4 track events per year. Although, after just one track event I am pretty hooked (I have a fever and the only prescription is VIR Full ).

Also, I don't care much about the noise level, but I do not want pads that will make the wheels nasty and hard to clean. But, from Mike's recommendations (OEMs) it sounds like dust may be unavoidable.

I think you should call Matt Nicholson at Carbotech. Club Member, Instructor, all-around good guy. Did I mention they support our Club??

Matt can hook you up with the right set-up. At least give those guys a shot at your business.

_________________
Brad

Anyone have any experience with Mintex C-Tech? How do they compare to Pagids?

_________________
Marek Rozanski

mdroz@me.com
919-648-2433

Not familar with the C-tech from Mintex, but their Redbox pads are horrible. Worse than stock in every way except dust.

_________________
91 Jetta GLI STS/DSP 111
85 Porsche 944 ASP 11
http://www.blackforestindustries.com

My experience is all auto-x and rallyx but the Carbotech pads are great. It's very nice to be able to deal with an active club supporter when you call.

--Kevin H.

_________________
2003 WRX (again!)

ran pagids (per Mike's suggestion) on my e36. two Rockinghams and 4 or 5 autoX es. dusty yes. worked very well for novice level, as i am that.

don't drive on the street much, so can't help there. am changing to hawk hp plus for front and hps rear as i am headed to VIR this weekend (still Novice) and the car has been modded, but i will keep the pagids as back-up.

On my M3, I use the Hawk HPS pads for street and autox and they are wonderful. I decide for HPDE events to have a dedicated set of rotors and pads primarily because of concerns I read about from using different brake pads (i.e. different compounds) on the same rotors. Not sure how valid it is. Mike Whitney would know much better about that (given his materials background).

_________________
Rob Harvey
919-697-5485
1997 BMW M3
1992 Acura Integra (Simon)