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 Post subject: Vette Brake Project
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:08 am 
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The Giver
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For those that have heard me talk about it, my Corvette brake project is actually coming along. For those who don't know, I'm adapting the PBR setup from a '95 ZR-1 to my Z-24. I finally installed the 12" rear rotors this weekend and got rid of those puny 8" drums back there.

The fronts require quite a bit of work to the front spindles to make the twin-piston PBR calipers and two-piece 12.2" rotors work. They are actually done and ready to install though. I plan to install them at the same time the new kevlar clutch and aluminum flywheel are added.

Here's a look at the finished project on the rears...

Image

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 1:26 pm 
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I err on the side of being stupid
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They still look small :?

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 1:55 pm 
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The Giver
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Ryan Holton wrote:
They still look small :?


This pic shows them behind my 17" wheels. When I put the 16s on you can't even see daylight! Besides they are bigger than yours! :wink:

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 1:57 pm 
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Vincent Keene wrote:
Ryan Holton wrote:
They still look small :?


This pic shows them behind my 17" wheels. When I put the 16s on you can't even see daylight! Besides they are bigger than yours! :wink:
Those are your rears and they are bigger than his fronts.

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http://www.v8mongrel.com/


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:14 pm 
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Rich Anderson wrote:
Vincent Keene wrote:
Ryan Holton wrote:
They still look small :?


This pic shows them behind my 17" wheels. When I put the 16s on you can't even see daylight! Besides they are bigger than yours! :wink:
Those are your rears and they are bigger than his fronts.



So, my car probably weighs 800 lbs less :P

We will see at Rockingham TT old man!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 3:01 pm 
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The Giver
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Ryan Holton wrote:
Rich Anderson wrote:
Vincent Keene wrote:
Ryan Holton wrote:
They still look small :?


This pic shows them behind my 17" wheels. When I put the 16s on you can't even see daylight! Besides they are bigger than yours! :wink:
Those are your rears and they are bigger than his fronts.



So, my car probably weighs 800 lbs less :P

We will see at Rockingham TT old man!


Yeah, yeah. And yours has 31HP less...BEFORE my reduction of 23lbs from my flywheel. Of course if I drove your car it would be faster... :wink:

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 3:08 pm 
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Vincent Keene wrote:
Yeah, yeah. And yours has 31HP less...BEFORE my reduction of 23lbs from my flywheel. Of course if I drove your car it would be faster... :wink:
And if you drove mine, you'd be faster still (I think).

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http://www.v8mongrel.com/


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:00 pm 
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Good deal Vincent. Now get the front ones mounted on those custom brackets and let's hear about some field testing. The front ones won't look small since they're dual piston calipers.

With all the time you two boys have spent in the cars together. I would think you'd already know whos is bigger by now :wink: :lol:

PS: You know that pin with the e-clip that it holding the bottom of the caliper in place on the front ones. Bring a spare pin and e-clip with you. And if you have originals and they have any indents on them, throw them away!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 8:29 am 
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Graham Jagger wrote:
You know that pin with the e-clip that it holding the bottom of the caliper in place on the front ones. Bring a spare pin and e-clip with you. And if you have originals and they have any indents on them, throw them away!


I have new pins and extra e-clips. Now if my old memory doesn't fail me and I end up leaving them at home. :roll:

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:09 am 
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Vincent Keene wrote:
Graham Jagger wrote:
You know that pin with the e-clip that it holding the bottom of the caliper in place on the front ones. Bring a spare pin and e-clip with you. And if you have originals and they have any indents on them, throw them away!


I have new pins and extra e-clips. Now if my old memory doesn't fail me and I end up leaving them at home. :roll:
Don't worry VK, I have a spare set of pins, spare e-clips and right now I am using, with some success, trailer pins that use an affixed retainer bar that cannot be lost that should allow for the whole issue to be put to bed.

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http://www.v8mongrel.com/


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 2:16 pm 
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The Giver
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I've finally finished this entire project. Here a pic of the fronts with ZR-1 calipers with custom 2-piece 12.2"dia x 1.1" thk rotors.

Image

Edit for a working link!

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)


Last edited by Vincent Keene on Tue Oct 25, 2005 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:23 pm 
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After almost two years of running this setup, my wallet decided it was time for ZR-1 BBK version 1.1. The current setup stops like no tomorrow, but as some of you know I've been fighting rotor cracking problems for a while. The current pair of rotors has held up "OK" I guess as they have about 4 events on them. They have the surface checks, but none that have made it to the edge and formed a crack...yet. Either way these rotors are getting too damn expensive to replace. At $300 a pair isn't just not worth it anymore, especially considering the C5 Vette guys can get NAPA blanks for their care for $29 each. :shock:

For a little history, the reasons I didn't go with stock Vette blanks from the get-go were as follows:

1. The offset of the Vette "hat" isn't quite what I need for ball joint/spoke clearance which isn't surprising since those weren't designed for FWD car. A 2-pc hat/rotor combo seemed to be better at the time since I could get the exact offset I needed.

2. I thought (at the time) the re-drilling the stock Vette rotors to fit my 5x100 lug pattern would get expensive. I was right about that except for the fact that the pattern doesn't need to be exact like I thought. The hub bore is what needs to be *exact* not the bolt holes. Hindsight is always 20/20 right? :roll:

3. I figured since these 2-pc rotors were massive for my car they'd last a VERY long time. WRONG!!!!! :x

OK, fast forward to present day and what I've learned so far and I know I could do it better and cheaper. Here are my thoughts/options:

Use a stock C4 HD Vette (J55 package) rotor up front. The HD version used on the ZR-1 and Grand Sport models were 13"x1.1" compared to my current 12.2” x 1.1” 2- pc rotors. I can re-drill the rotors myself and get a machined bushing for the difference between my center hub and the bore of the Vette rotor.

This would require me to move the caliper outboard about 3/8" which is the difference (radially) between the current 12.2" rotor and the new 13" one. That shouldn't really be a problem with my 17” wheels assuming the hat offset will work. FYI, The NAPA version of the Corvette J55 rotor is $59 which is about 1/3 of the price I pay now for the 2 pc blanks from Coleman Racing.

After a little more research, I discovered the stock Cobra Rotors (they share the same PBR caliper as the ZR-1 Vette and 1LE Camaro) have a shallower offset (closer to what I need) and are $20 cheaper than the Vette rotor from NAPA at $39 each. Ryan and I have figured that I'm currently spending $100 per track weekend just on rotors. If this works out I should be able to cut that number to one-fourth....$25.
OK, so let’s buy a Cobra rotor and do a little fitment experiment.

Last week I removed the 2-pc rotor for comparison to the stock Cobra rotor. I don’t have a shop so the kitchen table would have to do. Upon laying them flat, I was happy to see they were pretty close. After some measurements with my calipers, it turned out that the Cobra rotor is actually about 0.4” shallower than my current 2-pc ones. Well that’s good and bad. The good is there will be no interference with the spindle or ball joint. The bad is there could be interference with the wheel spokes. It’s too close to call w/o actually fitting the rotor onto the hub and seeing if there is in fact a clearance issue. I can use a small wheel spacer, but I don’t want to have to use one on track.

Next I made a template to re-drill the Cobra rotor using AutoCAD and modified the rotor at work. We actually have an old (really old, like 50 years old) drill press here at work. My template and our old drill press worked very well. Even using an el-cheapo 1/2" bit it wasn't *that bad*. I even beveled the trailing edges of the holes just like the factory ones.

Last weekend I removed a wheel and put the new Cobra rotor on for a test fit. Good news...it worked! At least with my street wheels that is. My track wheels have spokes that bend inward so they may not clear w/o running a spacer. I'd prefer not to run a spacer on track so I'll probably swap the tires between my street and track wheels and run spacers on the street.

Since the caliper needs to me moved outward, my current spindle brackets wouldn't work. They are welded in place so I really need to start over with another set of spindles. It’s a lot of work, but since I've done it before it's not that big of a deal. That and the fact I'll still have the old setup if a problem pops up at the last minute.

For the spindles Ryan and I went to LKQ in Clayton and I bought two for $50. I was off for the 4th and time for modifying them was at hand which brings us to the present photo diary of what it takes to put 13” Corvette/Cobra brakes on a Cavalier. Of course there is more work to be done, but here’s the progress so far.

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_________________
Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)


Last edited by Vincent Keene on Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:56 pm 
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This thread should be titled:

How to polish a turd in 10 easy steps!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 2:14 pm 
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Ryan Holton wrote:
This thread should be titled:

How to polish a turd in 10 easy steps!


Now that is just mean!!!!

I'm impressed with all the thinking and effort to make this work.
Now if Vincent can just figure out a way to make an LS1 fit in the Cavalier!!! :wink:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 3:14 pm 
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Nice work Vincent!

It sort of reminds me to the work that people goto to upgrade the rear brakes on a 914 (grinding and fabricating)! And that mounting plate reminds me of those used to mount Boxster brakes on a 914.

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