Street Touring tires?

Daniel Camacho · **Posted:** Wed Mar 16, 2016 4:59 pm

I was reading a forum somewhere and found some bad news about Kosei wheels.
This guy posted pics of his Kosei wheel after a track day, where 3 of the 6 spokes had cracked.
...All the way across.

Someone else on that forum answered that's why Koseis are cheap. You buy a set for cheap, you break them, and you replace them for cheap.

So, this is common knowledge to someone, but the first I had heard of it.

In case this is the reason I'm not getting many answers...
Please don't take it for granted that everybody knows which wheels are good and which ones are fragile.
That's why I'm asking.

So, I'm going to eliminate the Kosei wheels from consideration, and Rota for the same reason.
(I heard that Rota wheels were suspect, but I was taking it with a grain of salt.)

That means I still want to know what y'all collectively know about the Work wheels and the Volk Racing CE28N.
* How well do they stand up to a pothole in street driving?
* How well do they take the curbs at VIR?

The only clues I have are from watching Best Motoring and Hot Version. The tuned cars use a lot of Volk Racing and Advan wheels. The S2000 Touge Monster has CE28Ns. I have no idea if (or how often) the tuners are replacing wheels off camera.

Somebody out there knows this stuff...

Aaron Buckley · **Posted:** Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:24 pm

While Rota and Kosei have internet lore of wheels breaking apart, this can happen to any brand, including top brands like Volk, SSR, etc. (common Japanese Tuner wheels). If you're tracking your car, you should be checking your wheels after each event to ensure you have no stress cracks. I was pretty anal about it and would check them every two sessions of a track weekend. I ran Kosei K1's on a lot of cars over the years with no issues. I had Rotas on my STi with no issues.

You will pay more money for Volk, SSR's and others that are forged wheels. While they definitely are stronger than cast wheels, they are usually designed to be light, thus they don't do as well when hitting potholes on the street. For curbing you would see on most tracks, they should be fine as they have a rounded face to the curbs, which means less impact.

For my money, unless I absolutely loved the looks of a Volk like wheel, I would opt for something cheaper. Tire Rack is making wheels under TRMotorsport that are cheap, light and a lot of roadracers are using them. I would be looking in that direction. - AB

Richard Casto · **Posted:** Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:33 pm

Daniel, Welcome back!

Regarding the Kosei. If you look on the internet for examples of problems (with anything)... you will find it. Generally speaking, people post more about the issues they have than the fact they they have use a product for years without it killing them.

My comments are a single data point. I autocrossed and daily drove a set of Kosei for number of years with zero issues. I ended up selling them to another club member who I think used them for awhile after that. Granted that was a number of years ago and I can't speak to what the quality is today. Are the expensive forged wheels? No, so you likely can't expect them to perform like high dollar stuff. I would buy them again in a second for the same type of usage (autocross). But... you just have to watch them (probably like any cast wheel that is lightweight) if you are rough on them (potholes, track use, etc.).

Richard

Daniel Camacho · **Posted:** Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:36 pm

Aaron Buckley wrote:

...Tire Rack is making wheels under TRMotorsport that are cheap, light and a lot of roadracers are using them. I would be looking in that direction. - AB

Now that I looked them up, some of those wheels actually look nice.
...But the Tire Rack says they don't have any for my 240SX.

Chris Halweg · **Posted:** Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:40 am

There is a FB group that has lots of 240 wheels on it. Join and check, but be prepared to deal with lots of 'kids' on there.
Carolinanissans: For sale & parts.

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

Richard Casto wrote:

Daniel, Welcome back!

Regarding the Kosei. If you look on the internet for examples of problems (with anything)... you will find it. Generally speaking, people post more about the issues they have than the fact they they have use a product for years without it killing them.

My comments are a single data point. I autocrossed and daily drove a set of Kosei for number of years with zero issues. I ended up selling them to another club member who I think used them for awhile after that. Granted that was a number of years ago and I can't speak to what the quality is today. Are the expensive forged wheels? No, so you likely can't expect them to perform like high dollar stuff. I would buy them again in a second for the same type of usage (autocross). But... you just have to watch them (probably like any cast wheel that is lightweight) if you are rough on them (potholes, track use, etc.).

Richard

Yeah, I bought those wheels, used them for a couple years, sold them to a friend, and he used them for a couple years after that.

I ran a set of lightweight cast wheels (Sparco NT-R) for 220,000 miles and autocross duty on my 3 with no problems.

JamesMilko · **Posted:** Tue Mar 22, 2016 12:23 pm

Aaron Buckley wrote:

While Rota and Kosei have internet lore of wheels breaking apart, this can happen to any brand, including top brands like Volk, SSR, etc. (common Japanese Tuner wheels). If you're tracking your car, you should be checking your wheels after each event to ensure you have no stress cracks. I was pretty anal about it and would check them every two sessions of a track weekend. I ran Kosei K1's on a lot of cars over the years with no issues. I had Rotas on my STi with no issues.

Seconding this, wheels are a consumable on track cars.

Daniel Camacho · **Posted:** Fri Mar 25, 2016 5:53 pm

JamesMilko wrote:

Seconding this, wheels are a consumable on track cars.

I just talked to a local wheel supplier, who says the wheels I want are even more consumable on the street.

I said something like "What kind do I get if I'm paranoid about bending a wheel?"
He said "Get stock wheels to use when it's not race day."
I said "I'm not getting wheels to only use on race day." I can't rationalize spending a zillion dollars on a wheel I can't drive to work.

On top of that the guy was dead certain I couldn't get wheels for my 4x114.3 bolt pattern.

...Which really means whatever I decide on, I can't get it from him.
But, if I get it, I can take it to his shop and go "Pbpbpbpbpbpbpbththththththth!!!"

(Or something mature like that.)

Karl Shultz · **Posted:** Mon Mar 28, 2016 9:46 pm

Aaron Buckley wrote:

While Rota and Kosei have internet lore of wheels breaking apart, this can happen to any brand, including top brands like Volk, SSR, etc. (common Japanese Tuner wheels). If you're tracking your car, you should be checking your wheels after each event to ensure you have no stress cracks. I was pretty anal about it and would check them every two sessions of a track weekend. I ran Kosei K1's on a lot of cars over the years with no issues. I had Rotas on my STi with no issues.

You will pay more money for Volk, SSR's and others that are forged wheels. While they definitely are stronger than cast wheels, they are usually designed to be light, thus they don't do as well when hitting potholes on the street. For curbing you would see on most tracks, they should be fine as they have a rounded face to the curbs, which means less impact.

For my money, unless I absolutely loved the looks of a Volk like wheel, I would opt for something cheaper. Tire Rack is making wheels under TRMotorsport that are cheap, light and a lot of roadracers are using them. I would be looking in that direction. - AB

Aaron's experience parallels mine. I ran Kosei K1s for years and years. Enkeis too. Had a set of Rotas on my S2000 for street use. All of the above held up fine. My sense is that a set of impossibly light forged Volks (or whatever other fancy JDM wheel) probably holds up *as well* as a set of heavier set of cast wheels. They're stronger per ounce than cheap wheels, but there are fewer ounces.

Daniel Camacho · **Posted:** Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:11 pm

Hey, Karl! Did you used to drive an Integra? A black one?

Anyway, I was thinking for >$700/wheel the Volks better be pretty sturdy.

But... >$700/wheel.
And, the vendor says they're made to order, and there's a 3 month wait. :-/

So, I'm gonna put some more thought into "Plan B".

Karl Shultz · **Posted:** Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:43 pm

Daniel Camacho wrote:

Hey, Karl! Did you used to drive an Integra? A black one?

Anyway, I was thinking for >$700/wheel the Volks better be pretty sturdy.

But... >$700/wheel.
And, the vendor says they're made to order, and there's a 3 month wait. :-/

So, I'm gonna put some more thought into "Plan B".

Yep, that's me.

Nothing at all against buying the best. If you want a set of Volks, don't let me or anyone else stop you. They're bad ass. I knew plenty of guys who daily drove on things like Volk and Work and Rays and whatever other JDM forged wheel you can think of from my S2000 days. I don't remember anyone having ever bent one, but most of those guys didn't go to the track, either.

I didn't catch the size requirements, but if you're looking at $700/wheel, there are other routes available. You could get a set of CCWs made to any specs you want, in any design you want, for that money or maybe a little less. I did that very thing when I had my S2000. They were about 15lb/each, stock legal, and exactly what I wanted. VERY strong wheels. You can get Panasports custom made here if you're into a more classic look.

Daniel Camacho · **Posted:** Mon Apr 04, 2016 7:46 pm

Karl Shultz wrote:

Daniel Camacho wrote:

Hey, Karl! Did you used to drive an Integra? A black one?

Yep, that's me.

Hey, Rice! I'd love to make it to a THSCC event and see you again. I think I last went to one in 2012.
It was Rodney's last event as prez, and he was one of two faces I recognized. :-/

...And I don't think Rodney ever figured out who was turning his numbers upside down.

Daniel Camacho · **Posted:** Mon Apr 04, 2016 8:02 pm

Karl Shultz wrote:

Daniel Camacho wrote:

>$700/wheel. o.O
And, the vendor says they're made to order, and there's a 3 month wait. :-/

...Nothing at all against buying the best. If you want a set of Volks, don't let me or anyone else stop you. They're bad ass. I knew plenty of guys who daily drove on things like Volk and Work and Rays and whatever other JDM forged wheel you can think of from my S2000 days. I don't remember anyone having ever bent one, but most of those guys didn't go to the track, either.

I didn't catch the size requirements, but if you're looking at $700/wheel, there are other routes available. You could get a set of CCWs made to any specs you want, in any design you want, for that money or maybe a little less. I did that very thing when I had my S2000. They were about 15lb/each, stock legal, and exactly what I wanted. VERY strong wheels. You can get Panasports custom made here if you're into a more classic look.

I might consider some other wheel. With tax and shipping, the Volks would collectively cost more than I paid for the car.

Also, after the Tidewater Sports Car Club event last Sunday, I realized how much I miss having a limited-slip in my 240SX.
My S14 (that my wife wrecked) had an LSD.
Sunday, my S13 spent a lot of each run spinning one tire and sliding around.

And, as I predicted, I was in the "F U if you don't have a Miata" class. Six drivers, 4 Miata's, an MR2, and a 240SX with a driver way out of practice...

This car hasn't been classed competitively the whole time I've owned it, and wheels may not fix it.
...But I found the factory LSD I bought from somebody, and it's going in the S13 this year.

Chris Halweg · **Posted:** Mon Apr 04, 2016 10:22 pm

Once I got an LSD in my s14 it was night and day. You might just want to focus on getting some sticky street tires on whatever wheels you can find used/cheap for now and get everything else sorted on the car first. Once you have the car/driver sorted, then for your next set of tires figure out what wheels you want to run. By then you might find a good deal on a set while you're looking, but not needing.

Richard Casto · **Posted:** Tue Apr 05, 2016 5:39 pm

Daniel Camacho wrote:

This car hasn't been classed competitively the whole time I've owned it, and wheels WILL NOT fix it.

Fixed it for you!

As someone said earlier... Not telling you how to spend your money or to dissuade you from buying some nice wheels, but when it comes to performance gains, it's not going to give you much if really anything. I say this with full expectation that as I finish up my 914, I will likely spend some serious money on period correct performance wheels.

Chris Halweg wrote:

You might just want to focus on getting some sticky street tires on whatever wheels you can find used/cheap for now and get everything else sorted on the car first.

Richard

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