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 Post subject: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:34 pm 
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I know just enough to get myself in trouble when it comes to car detailing, and I have some of the basics down (2 bucket wash, claying a car, using masking tape to not hate life), but I am ready for the next step up: using a DA polisher.

However, I have no idea what types of products I should buy outside of the actual orbital itself (looking at the PC 7424XP or the Griot's DA). I've heard good things about most of Meguiar's stuff, but I haven't seen a comprehensive list of tools and products somebody should buy outside of the Autogeek kits.

If Karl wants to come in and lay down the detailing law, I won't complain.

Thanks!!


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:12 pm 
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I'm not an expert by an means but I can share a couple of experiences and opinions:

1. DA polisher - prepare to be underwhelmed. I only use it now to remove swirl marks from my direct drive polisher
2. I use 3M-39109 and 39009 swirl mark remover almost exclusively with the DA. I wax directly after. No complaints
3. The direct-drive polisher (I use a Makita) does an amazing job of paint correction but (duh) leaves swirls.
4. I've never found a polishing compound that I'm really happy with. UFC in my experience work fantastic but blemishes tend to come back after a few months (??), so I suspect it does some filling rather than actual abrasive paint removal. 3M rubbing compound works great but in my experience is hard to work with (gets gummy fast)
5. Direct-drive polishers can get you in trouble. Start with a car you don't care about too much.

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whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:25 pm 
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This wouldn't be a bad start, but you'll find opinions are all over the place on detailing supplies, etc.
http://www.tools-plus.com/meguiars-205-105-lc1.html?utm_medium=feed&utm_source=froogle&utm_term=MEG205-105-LC1&gclid=CIKjkJCGl7oCFZKk4Aod9wkAZQ

Of course paying attention to paint (clear coat) depth is a worthwhile objective also.

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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:48 pm 
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My stiffness is only an illusion
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Karl laid this info on me for engine detailing....

http://www.s2ki.com/home/2010/02/26/s20 ... ling-tips/

As for the outside of the car, I usually buy my stuff from Majestic in regard to chemicals. I'd buy the microfiber at the cheapest place you can, Wallyworld or Tarjett....

I use the following stuff on my "award" winning bullitt :mrgreen:

BuffLite II: for a light weight cutting paste. Get's rid of swirls and other embedded junk on the paint. Use this w/ a "cutting" pad on the buffer
Vitreo: Use this for the final sealer. You can get this on pebble grained plastics w/ no issues. Won't turn white. Also used w/ a polishing pad on the buffer
leather and plastic cleaner: Use is on the plastic and leather seats for cleaning. Leaves a matted finish, no gloss crap. Spray on and wipe off. Only down side I found for this stuff is if it rains, it will streak on the door panel. Easy enough to respray and clean.
QuickSlick: This is a quick detailer, but don't get this on the plastic stuff, will turn white. When I hit PA this year, this quick detailer made the car look great and took off bugs w/ no issues.
PolyProtectant: Supposed to be the leather and vinyl protectant, but Karl said to use this under the hood. NO GLOSS! See the above ref'd link for Karl's info.

That's all I got....

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'08 Bullitt mustang, CAM 7
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proud recipient of the Bowie Grey service award '12
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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:52 pm 
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I have detailed the S2000 and WRX with the PC orbital you referenced using Griot's compounds. Works very well, even for a noob like me. Demonstrable difference after completion.

This was a good reference, but obviously defer to Karl over a website.
http://www.autogeek.net/detailingtips.html

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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:20 pm 
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Andrew, I think you want a rupes big foot. I have been looking at DAPs for a few months and it seems like the best option (but expensive).


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:45 pm 
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Alec Moody wrote:
Andrew, I think you want a rupes big foot. I have been looking at DAPs for a few months and it seems like the best option (but expensive).

This thread has triggered me to jump on the research bandwagon. There are a few minor scratches on Tina's Fit that I need to address. I found this video interesting...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTzQLeJOelg

The Rupes looks cool, but I can't justify that amount of money for something I likely will not use that much.

Richard

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Richard Casto
1972 Porsche 914
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Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 1:57 pm 
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My stiffness is only an illusion
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Location: on line looking at car ads
If you have scratches and chips, then Dr Colorchip does a great job at small repairs.

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Rodney

'08 Bullitt mustang, CAM 7
Autox VP '09-'10, President '11-'12, interim President 2nd half of ‘14
proud recipient of the Bowie Grey service award '12
Now just a guy driving a mustang....


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:29 pm 
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I've found the DRIVE Clean and the other Ammo NYC clips to be helpful for techniques and do's/don'ts.


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:04 am 
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Got Powah?
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Richard Casto wrote:
Alec Moody wrote:
Andrew, I think you want a rupes big foot. I have been looking at DAPs for a few months and it seems like the best option (but expensive).

This thread has triggered me to jump on the research bandwagon. There are a few minor scratches on Tina's Fit that I need to address. I found this video interesting...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTzQLeJOelg

The Rupes looks cool, but I can't justify that amount of money for something I likely will not use that much.

Richard


I have taken a few scratches out of friends and neighbor's cars on-the-spot. Got it down to a quick procedure, but, again, I'm not a pro:

1. Drag a fingernail across the scratch. Slight or no interruption? Go ahead. Major divot? "Sorry, no help here"
2. Scratch Removal: Makita direct drive + Lake Country yellow pad + 3M rubbing compound. Wipe with cheap microfiber. Repeat in 10 second blasts (not too hot!) until the scratch is gone or I get nervous about burning away too much clear coat.
3. Swirl removal: DA + white Lake Country pad + 3M SMR (see above), wipe with microfiber
4. Slap on some wax of choice (I still use an old can of Carnuba) and buff

Takes about 10 minutes and makes smiles. I think any potential "improvements" to this process are just in pad and compound selection, but like I said, what I have works for me, but I'm open to new options.

Still requires investment in a good DA and direct polisher, as well as a couple of pads. I use yellow and while exclusively, but I'm no waxer. So my limited experience functional kit would be:

- DA polisher (PC)
- Direct drive (Makita / others)
- 2 each yellow and white pads (Lake Country / others)
- Abrasive rubbing compound (3M / UFC / your choice)
- SMR (3M / Meguiars / your choice)
- Microfibers (the Sam/s club stuff is great)

Anything beyond that is gravy or for the true waxers. That's a functional kit.

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Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:16 am 
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I got a SUX2000!
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Location: In the garage, under a big old Mercedes
I'll come back to this tomorrow. :)

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2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:22 pm 
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I got a SUX2000!
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Location: In the garage, under a big old Mercedes
If I were buying a DA polisher today, and needed a getting started kit, I'd buy one of these:

1. The more conventional, foam pads:
http://www.detailersdomain.com/Griots-G ... p_690.html (that's on sale right now, too)

2. The newfangled, microfiber pads:
http://www.detailersdomain.com/Griots-G ... p_703.html

Microfiber pads are the new thing, and I've tried it. I've got a couple of Surbuf microfiber cutting pads, and I worked on an E60 (? whatever the V10 one is) M6 with them, alongside both Meguiar's M105 cutting compound, and some Menzerna FG400. The Meguiar's stuff seemed more effective, and the Menzerna stuff was a giant pain in the ass to remove from the panel once I'd worked it.

I lean towards the Griot's machine because, as far as I know, it has a longer throw than the Porter Cable does, and throw is what you want. I think that a Flex, or a Rupes, is probably better. But they should be - they're twice as expensive. I doubt a home detailer needs anything like that.

Even though I saw success with the DA, and I still think it's a good machine, I always end up back with my rotary (direct drive) Makita. I'm faster with it, I'm better with it, and I find it much more pleasant to use. My old Porter Cable DA feels like it's shaking me to pieces when I use it, and the Makita is smooth as glass. The Makita is a perfect tool. The controls are placed perfectly, it's well weighted, wel balanced, and durable. For a rotary I wouldn't consider anything else.

Pads are very much a personal preference thing. My favorites are some 3M ones I had sent over from the UK. My second favorite are the Uber pads, from detailersdomain.com. I use the yellow foam one, and the blue finishing one. Usually those are the only two I need.

Menzerna 85RD is still the best finishing polish I've ever used. That and a blue foam Uber pad is a zero cut combo that really makes the difference. It's the difference between "that's a nice car" and "that car just won its category at a PCA concours."

I'm a big, big fan of Malco UFC, and have not seen anything to suggest it's got fillers in it. The label states as much. If I need it to cut aggressively, I'll run it at 2000rpm, or maybe even faster, and use a cutting pad. With most colors, I've found that if I work UFC long enough, it hardly leaves any swirls behind at all. If it does, chances are I'm coming back with a blue pad and a finishing polish anyway.

When using a rotary, use masking tape on things you don't want to hit with the polisher. Antennas, gaskets, emblems, that kind of stuff. The outermost part of that pad is moving FAST, and it's easy to mark something up. I like the green, 3M auto body tape you can buy at most auto parts stores. It's thicker and stickier than blue painter's tape.

Mike, I wonder if the reappearance of swirls after using UFC is because of the cheap microfibers you're using. I don't have hard evidence to back this up, but it's the only difference I can see. Cheap microfibers are pretty forgiving if you're doing something like using a quick detailer spray. But for removing polish residue, or LSP, you're sometimes having to rub pretty hard. I'd rather use something softer. Chemical Guys sells some good microfibers on Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A8M ... UTF8&psc=1

These are also really good for the money:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009I ... UTF8&psc=1

I like to dry my cars with the electric leaf blower from my shop vac. Try it, it works great. Less laundry to do, and the less frequently you touch your car's paint, the less likely you are to introduce swirls.

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:10 pm 
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Testing

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1972 Porsche 914
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2015 Honda Fit EX
http://motorsport.zyyz.com
Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:32 pm 
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e: looks like I triggered some hidden functionality of the forum. Spooky.

I picked up a Griot's DA today for $90 (yay Amazon Lightning Deal), and now I need to get the expensive parts. This is my current shopping list: http://pastebin.com/1347S4AM

Am I missing anything?


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 Post subject: Re: Need help assembling a detailing kit
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:49 pm 
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I got a SUX2000!
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Location: In the garage, under a big old Mercedes
You MIGHT find that you need a middle step between M105 and the Menzerna finishing polish. M105 is very aggressive, and can leave behind holograms. And the Menzerna stuff is zero cut, so it might not have enough cut of its own to finish down the marks you left behind with the M105. That's not definite, but it's certainly possible. Lots of people finish down to LSP with M105, even with dark cars. I've never really tried to.

Lake Country pads aren't my favorite, but lots of people like them. I have no direct experience with some of the colors you've chosen, but my sense is that your Menzerna final finishing polish would be better off with the gold "jeweling" pad. If the place you buy the stuff from allows you the flexibility, swap one of your two blue ones for a green. That should be plenty of flexibility. Getting two yellow pads is good move, because the cutting pads can cake up quickly since they tend to be more open. With a rotary this isn't a big deal, you can use a stiff, nylon brush on the pad with the machine running to unclog it. But I get mixed results doing this with a DA. It works, kind of.

I might have some old, but barely used, Lake Country pads in my collection. I may have already given them away, but I'll look a little later tonight to see for sure.

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)


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