THSCC Forums

A couple of years ago I had played around with the thought of a new Stock Car racing series. The difference between this one and the others that proceeded it is the classes. In my series the cars would be classed according to their price and production numbers, not their HP/Lbs. ratio and handling prowess.

Here’s the basic idea. All cars would be Stock, except for safety equipment. The classes would pan out something like this.
Cars Under $25K and more than 30K built a year.
Cars Under $50K and more than 20K
Cars Under $75K and more than 10K built
Cars Over $75K and Over 1K Built a year.

I won’t care if was a coupe, sedan, station wagon in any of the classes. Let the Manufactures fight out on who really has the best cars for the money.

This would also keep the one off’s from winning a series when it doesn’t reflect any car in their line. The Manufacturers would have to install any winning parts on their production cars first before it shows up on the race version. It may get some builders off their but if their car gets beat every time.

So would anyone here watch this?

Not in the US Marty. People in the US buy cars based on how they look and how fast they accelerate. Nobody really cares how good a car is overall other than us autox and roadrace people. You know the ALMS is based on production numbers. I think World Challenge has some Production stipulations too. I do think it's a neat Idea, but after a season it'd be a one car series in each class. Besides that'd really screw up what car and driver does to tell you what the best car is. Putting a 0-60 time on the cover of a mag is all important to a cars performance you know.

_________________
2006 Civic Si - #24 HS for 2015

2005 GMC Sierra
1991 318is Garage Ornament

I had always heard people bought cars on Price and percieved value in the US (or the often catch phrase - Bang for the Buck). Which is why the Camry and Accords are the #1 selling cars. As far as Performance images go, yes the mighty 0-60 and HP figures rule, which is funny to me because peak HP tells nothing about the total TQ curve.

Those would be some pretty boring classes...

I like the idea, but the production numbers are a little on the high side.

Among the many cars not eligible...

Toyota MR2 Spyder (fewer than 10,000 per year, but the price is around $50,000)

Toyota Celica GTS
Toyota Celica GT (only the first year of a model ever meets those production numbers)

Toyota Supra

Acura NSX

Corvette Z06

Subaru WRX, STi

etc...

Set all production numbers at 1000 units (or lower) and keep the price divisions.

Why should the enthusiast be at the mercy of the "normal" population, obviously our shopping habits differ from the "norm."

Scott

I think a cooler thing to do would be to start a magazine where cars are giving good tests and have honest evaluations. Motor week is the only current one I can stomach but it's not popular. Think about the reviews different cars would get from people in our club. I'm sure I've changed some minds that the Cavalier isn't a brick wobbling down the road on square wheels. How the cars are tested is fine in my opinion, with the exception of power and acceleration. My problem is more how the results are interpreted. Your series would be a great answer to this if there were a variety of racing types for the cars. Unfortunally if the cars are actually close to stock there will be a car in each class that beats everything else and it won't be interesting to watch. To cure this you'd have to add weight or cut power on the top cars, which would then make crappy cars look better than they actually are, and then again you get the perceived image that something is better than it actually is.

_________________
2006 Civic Si - #24 HS for 2015

2005 GMC Sierra
1991 318is Garage Ornament

Some, but not all

They wouldn't be excluded, just moved up a class. The actual cut off numbers would need to be fined tuned.

As far as one model winning all the time, that would just show that it's a better car as far as this series goes. Maybe it would get the other Manufactures off their buts.

If the Z06 is whooping up on the $75K+ cars, then that shows how good the Z06 really is for $50K.

If you set the prod numbers as low as 1K, then the manufactures will design a ringer, sell 1K to their supported teams and certain privateers and nothing would be available to the general public.

There also needs to be a rule about a car can not compete until it goes on sale to the public. Otherwise you could also get Cars like the M3 GTR (hmm, yeah, we are going to sell a V8 M3....Someday).

Ahhh yes, the BMW GTS car.

_________________
2006 Civic Si - #24 HS for 2015

2005 GMC Sierra
1991 318is Garage Ornament

I think the key to make all the Makers happy and have more than one model winning is to mix up the types of tracks. Have the tight/twisty tracks so the lower HP foreign cars (and maybe domestic, you never know)can shine. Then have more open venues where the higher HP vehicles can stretch their legs. Think about a Camaro against a WRX. Each could easily win depending on the track.

One other point I thought about is to let cars compete up to 2 years after production dates. That way if a Maker stops builing a car (ie F-Bodies), the privateers can still run them for two years.

Ok,
I aquired and tried to built the $25K class in SCGT and ran a few races just for kicks.

Here's the cars than ran (in A-Z Order):
Acura RSX
Chevy Z28
Dodge SRT-4
Ford Focus SVT
Ford Mustang GT
Honda Civic Si
Mazda Miata 1.8T
Mini Cooper
Nissan Sentra SE-R
Subaru WRX
VW Gti (1.8T)

And just for kicks:
1972 Datsun 240Z (upped to 180 HP).

I tried to make sure the vehicle settings were as close to stock as possible. The results were intersting and also the way I thought they were.

On long Open tracks the Camaro Dominated, opening up large gaps on the straight aways. On Mildly tight course with smaller straights, the WRX came into it's own. And on the Really tight courses the Miata and Mini Cooper where fighting it out. They real fun part was how close the racing was in many cases and if the lead car (even the Z28 on open courses) made a mistake, it was another model who won. Certain cars were not competitive as expected, but there were at 5 that could when at any time (including the 2100 lbs 240Z).

it was actually entertaining to watch, even for a Computer Generated race.