looking for a new DD and autox car

Ryan Holton · **Posted:** Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:19 pm

Wait until Mazda comes to their senses and puts the Mazdaspeed3 motor in the 2. It fits.

Andrew Jonell · **Joined:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:43 pm **Posts:** 1350

Ryan, can't really wait.

Trip report~~

The Fiat dealership was pretty slow from the time that I arrived until the time that I was in the car. The test drive was a nice circuit that gave a lot of variety as to how the car performs in different environments. The Fiat 500 does have a consistent feeling from the driver's perspective: it drives like ass. The clutch is obnoxiously high, the steering is absolutely worthless unless if you put it in Sport mode, and I hope you like understeer. The traction control was pretty aggressive when I was tooling around in a parking lot, and turning it off just made it understeer without cutting off the gas; a major difference. The interior was pretty well thought out and I do like the gauges, but the knobs were soooooooo flimsy for the AC controls. I guess bonus points for having Bluetooth connectivity standard and the USB charger/plug-in and AUX port in the glove box with a nice little net. I want to like the car so bad, but my god is it just terrible to drive. Oh, and the gearbox was pretty uninspired.

Mazda2 feels good man. The dash has a lot of textured plastic, but there aren't miles and miles of it and it isn't postured in an offensive way (see: Ford Focus). The clutch feels good, the steering is spot on, and the brakes are boosted the proper amount. It has no power and is actually slower to 60mph than my Miata, but it doesn't feel slow unless if you're staring at the tach and expecting to feel the non-existent torque throw you somewhat into the back of the seat... it was almost like driving a Honda. The rear seats are easy to get into and there is some leg room for normal sized people.

I talked some numbers with Mazda and made sure to state "HELLO, I AM NOT BUYING TODAY," but they still ran the numbers when I asked about the S-Plan. Turns out the S-Plan isn't that great: $16,578 + TTF for a Mazda2 Touring with 5 on the... uh.. dash? The one I test drove had the center armrest (worthless), but even with that added on Truecar is showing $15.9k. I think I'm going to be calling up the dealership up in Virginia this upcoming week and getting my paperwork in order to take the Black Touring off of their hands.

JamesShort · **Posted:** Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:00 pm

EPPs in general are never worth a damn. You can always negotiate better prices.

I paid $900 *under* invoice on the 09 Accord (not counting the pin stripes and mud guard which I said I'm not paying for).

I paid $250 *over* invoice on the WRX but got 0% financing. Still was over $1000 under the listed price.

I paid $300 *under* invoice on the SI but I did a trade in during the transaction so it's a give and take with the negotiations so you could also say I paid MSRP but got a KILLER trade in value. Anyway.....getting rid of the timebomb...I mean WRX, was my main priority that day so I didn't push it any more than I already did.

Main thing is letting them know quite clearly that you don't NEED a new car nor do you NEED to drive away that day with a new car. Come armed with financing/cash from the get go (even if you intend to try to get promotional financing from the manufacturer since this part comes AFTER the negotiations are made). Do *not* talk about car payments. When they bring that itemized bullshit list of car price and options and TTT and invoice to make you feel bad about how little money they are making on the sale, just scribble it all out completely and on the bottom line, write a single number: OTD and look up at them and nod. Be stern, but not combative. Goal is to be the one in power and not vice versa.

Ryan Holton · **Posted:** Sat Jan 14, 2012 3:53 pm

Andrew Jonell wrote:

I think I'm going to be calling up the dealership up in Virginia this upcoming week and getting my paperwork in order to take the Black Touring off of their hands.

Awesome but why no 31 pages?

Can't wait to see one up close.

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Sat Jan 14, 2012 4:29 pm

Andrew Jonell wrote:

power

Andrew, you're not allowed to use this word in this thread any longer. Although it still has exactly twice what my first car had when it rolled off the lot in '86. :mrgreen:

j/k

Good luck with the negotiations. You mentioned room, and I was really impressed with the 2's room because I had to put one of the baby Recaros in the back of the one in the photo ot pick up my son the other day. The truck space is sort of cramped but it's still 3x that of most roadsters.

Ryan Holton wrote:

Wait until Mazda comes to their senses and puts the Mazdaspeed3 motor in the 2. It fits.

Whoa. This plus a good LSD. That's kinda scary.

What's the most competitive autocross class that could fall in? SSM?

steve remchak · **Posted:** Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:10 pm

The truck space

this will be Freudian someday Mr. McGrain,

Andrew Jonell · **Joined:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:43 pm **Posts:** 1350

Talked with a salewoman over the phone.

17k OTD:
15.9k for the car
425 in tax
63 in tax and title
499 "Processing Fees"

uh oh, just saw something fun: http://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/comme ... study7.asp

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:09 pm

steve remchak wrote:

a good mechanic and trust fund money in the bank.

Fix
It
Again
Tony

That's funny coming from a Hans lover who lives by:

Breaks
My
Wallet

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:13 pm

Nice find.

2. If a dealer charges a processing fee it:
A. Must be posted in the public sales area.
B. Cannot be more than $250.

Andrew Jonell · **Joined:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:43 pm **Posts:** 1350

Oh yeah, forgot to mention that she refused to send me an email about my inquiry. Weird.

JamesShort · **Posted:** Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:45 pm

When I negotiate prices on cars they always print up the final itemized list with the dealer fees as they are listed and just change the cars price appropriately.

6 of 1, half a dozen of another.....I don't care how they do it, I just work with OTD prices and work backwards to figure out the 3% HUT and cars 'base price'.

Andrew Jonell · **Joined:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:43 pm **Posts:** 1350

I'm OK with 17kish OTD, I'm not OK when they're trying to charge double for a fee where they shouldn't be according to the DMV.

e: Nothing is open today as well, ughh...

JamesShort · **Posted:** Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:01 pm

Andrew Jonell wrote:

I'm OK with 17kish OTD, I'm not OK when they're trying to charge double for a fee where they shouldn't be according to the DMV.

e: Nothing is open today as well, ughh...

The fee is $250 for DMV processing and other bullshit and the rest is 'stick Benjamins in my pocket' fees to the dealer.

Jason Mauldin · **Posted:** Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:05 pm

Matt McGrain wrote:

Nice find.

2. If a dealer charges a processing fee it:
A. Must be posted in the public sales area.
B. Cannot be more than $250.

I think that is a quiz, with the answers at the bottom. The answer is A, it must be posted publicly. Not B. Look at "1" above it.

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Mon Jan 16, 2012 1:15 pm

I agree James. Working backwards is best, especially if you're trading in a car, although I'm yet to do it when I can sell them to a private party without losing $$$ on ole Autotrader. It sucks that the superdeluxo ad is $75 now though! It used to be like $30 when I was in school and generated a better response.

I paid about $400 in BS that I've never paid for upon purhcase as the S2000 was my first car from a dealer. I have to say, tossing the 90 day tag in the trash yesterday felt good. Unless it's a screaming deal (albeit, you're always rolling the dice when you can't talk to the previous owner), I probably won't buy another car, unless it's new from the dealer again just because the 'fees' aggravate the hell out of me.

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