THSCC Forums

Hi,

Before I do my next track event, I was told I need to get arm restraints since I am in a convertable. From what I have found online, arm restraints are attached to your racing harness. I currently don't have a racing harness, so I was wondering if there was somewhere else they could attach and still be compliant with the rules. If anyone has any insight on this, please let me know. Thanks in advance,

Craig Dawson

Craig what kinda of car? Do you have Roll bar that you fit underneath with your helmut on in the car?

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David Teague
2015 Lexus IS 250c
1994 Honda Del Sol HS 39
2009 Dodge Journey R/T
http://teaguefamily.us

I have a Miata with a Hard Dog roll bar. There is plenty of clearance above my head, even with my helmet on. thanks.

Therotically, you should have arm restraints for both you and your instructor (most don't, I carry my own for my convertible instructing experiences). As to where to attach them if you don't have a harness, I have no good suggestions. The other option is to run with the top up, thus avoiding the whole issue.

Hum... random thought... go get some climbing carabeeners (sp?) and clip them on the the regular belts using those perhaps? Only issue with that is that they would still be attached even though you might release your belts tt vacate the car in an emergency... you and your passenger would still have to unclip one side each.

Also, if you get these (instead of going with the top up option), please use them properly... meaning that your arms cannot come out of the car to do "regular" passing signals... you'll need to let people in the driver's meeting know you'll be doing in-car signals.

Diane ~ fellow Miata owner

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Diane (Hall) Bundas
1992 Spec Miata #48 - 1997 Chevy Tahoe - 2007 Honda Civic Coupe

Buy some harnesses.

I would think twice about instructing in a rollbarred Miata without harnesses. Think about the consequences in a roll. The factory 3-points may not keep you attached to the car and subsequently your head off of the ground.

Seriously, get some harnesses. What reason could you have to NOT get some, once you have a bar in the car?

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Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

I agree that a harness provides much more support than a factory 3point belt. The harnesses then lead to the next question - Is there a good way to install a 5 or 6 point harness in a car with a factory seat? I sure can't figure a way in a Miata. The "sub" belt wraps up from the front over the soft part of the seat which would compress and cause the harness to ride upwards.
The options appear to be:
- Cut a hole in the factory seat (or junkyard procured alternative - thanks Ron).
- Put in a proper racing seat

I'm leaning towards the racing seat because it would help me get a little lower in the car. Why lower? Better bar clearance for my head (although I pass today) and more room between the seat and the bottom of the steering wheel to facillitate heal and toe'ing. The bottom of the steering wheel really gets in the way with the stock seat.
Of course, a racing seat is another step towards not having a street driveable car, so the trailer and tow vehicle and divorce (jokin') loom in the distance.

I feel like I'm attempting to prove Diane's point about spending money on your car. Sorta like pointing yor skis straight downhill, you pick up speed pretty fast ......

Frank

Thanks for all of the suggestions. I will probably go ahead and get the harnesses, however, I have wondered the same thing as Frank. With the factory seats, the middle strap will not work properly due to the length of the seat. If anyone has any suggestions please let me know. Thanks,

Craig

Three words:
Six point harnesses.

I had them in the C5 and now have them in the M3. Both times with stock seats. Attach the two sub strap points to the same points as the lap belt and sit on the anti sub belt (which then comes up between your legs). I had a student tell me they were the same as in his F18 (Marine Aviator). If it's good enough for carrier landings, it's good enough for my track car.

-Matt

I simply made a 2" long slit in the seat seam (my black '96 Miata had a double seam horizontally across the seat in about the right place) and brought the sub belt up through that. If you like, upholstery shops can whip the edges, sew a piece of seam tape around the hole, or sew in a little 'trap door" that makes it look almost OEM. Now that Steve Blalock has the car, you may want to take a look at the driver's seat - Gresham Lake Upholstery put in the little trap door for me. Another issue, if you don't get a racing seat, is keeping the shoulder belts from slipping down off the sides of your shoulders. If you get a harness, seriously consider either a sternum latch or the "H" type belts to hold them together across your chest.

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Marvin McBride
Spec Miata #62

Just be sure that whatever you do for you, you also do for your instructor.

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Diane (Hall) Bundas
1992 Spec Miata #48 - 1997 Chevy Tahoe - 2007 Honda Civic Coupe

Thanks again for all the advice. I'm glad to hear that others have been able to use racing harnesses with stock seats. I'll be sure to do the same to the passenger side for the brave instructor who is going to strap in the car with me Thanks everyone.

Craig Dawson

Craig:

Send me your email address and I'll send you the Competition Mounting
direcctions from Simpson that are SCCA GCR compliant. I have inspected
at least a dozen Miata's with Roll Bars for our series and I have yet to
see major problems installing harnesses in these cars using the
holizontal bar on the roll bar for the sholders and the stock mounts
for the lap belts. Check out Ron Spencers, Karl Kauffman,or Diane
Hall's (second thought that may be a long drive, skip Diane) cars.
The anti sub strap should not go in front of the front seat it needs
to go through the bottom of the seat and mount not more
than 20 degrees from where your spine wound intercept the floor.
IF its too far back it can put crushing loads on your pelvis and if its
to far forward it will not be effective preventing rib cage intrusion.
The main issue we see with Miata's is helmet height but you already
got some good suggestions on that so I won't repeat.

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Mark Vitacco
THSCC TT Chairman
mvitacco@bellsouth.net

One issue with Hard Dog Hard Core roll bars for the Miata, beyond the clearance issues for all Miatae (I'm now somewhat infamous for being black-flagged at CMP because my instructor was too tall): some of the Hard Dog Hard Core roll bars come with a harness bar, some don't - they have a metal tab that goes underneath the metal package shelf that has a threaded hole for an eyebolt to fit down into. This may be fine for autox, however, this ends up with you connecting both shoulder belts to a single point, which is not SCCA-compliant (despite Hard Dog advertising that their bars are for the "serious Solo I competitor"). If you have a roll bar without the harness bar, just bite the bullet and have Chris Schimmel (or your welder of choice) weld one in for you.

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Marvin McBride
Spec Miata #62

Thanks for the info. Mark, my e-mail is "cdawson at carolinalights dot com"

Marvin, I do have the Hard Dog Hard Core, which has the harness tabs. They do advertise that as being compliant for Solo I. So can Chris weld a harness bar into my existing Hard Dog bar? Thanks,

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'01 Mazda Miata
www.zoomcubedracing.com

The arm restraints slip over the lap belt so I think it would be impossible to make them work on OEM belts. BTW, if you need a set of arm restraints let me know. I have 2 sets that I don't need any longer.

Ron