Mazda vs SCCA?

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

Todd Breakey wrote:

You know, it's funny, I just went to Pontiac.com to build a Solstice GXP Z0K with a CFHT and I couldn't do it.

The Club Sport package (I assume this is the Z0K package) is not clickable and I couldn't find a factory hard top available as an option anywhere. Maybe I'm missing something.

Any help would be appreciated.

Todd - they knew you weren't serious, so the secret pop-up page was suppressed.

Ford knows I'm not serious about trading in my 2007 Mustang GT, so when I go to www.fordvehicles.com, I can find no mention of a model called the "Ford Mustang Shelby GT", as it is named in the 4/2007 Fastrack. (Actually, I know that the Shelby GT is a product of Shelby Automobiles, Inc., and sold through dealers who also happen to be Ford dealers. I'll bet that if I upgraded my Mustang to include the Ford Racing suspension, chassis and powertrain parts included on the Shelby GT, I'd be right back in ESP.

)

Donnie Barnes · **Posted:** Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:36 am

Art, there are plenty of people who believe you can legally convert a GT to a Shelby GT by getting the right parts. There are many who also believe that it would be no faster on an autocross course, it'll just drive a little different. See Sam Strano's posts on the matter (a GT owner, but competed in a Shelby GT). There' s also the question of how the Bullitt will be...

And love the move or hate the move, putting the Shelby GT increased participation in a class that was dying quickly otherwise. Put it this way...would you rather have the Shelby GT in FS, or would you rather FS have gone away?

--Donnie

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:26 pm

Donnie Barnes wrote:

Put it this way...would you rather have the Shelby GT in FS, or would you rather FS have gone away?
--Donnie

Great decision. SEB did good.

FYI my first half dozen or so autocrosses were in my new 1969 Mustang GT. I did absolutely terrible. No skill, wrong tires, wrong version of the car, wrong brand car, etc. :oops:

Still got hooked on the sport.

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

Donnie Barnes wrote:

there are plenty of people who believe you can legally convert a GT to a Shelby GT by getting the right parts.

What do the majority of SEB members believe?

Sure, you can get all of the mechanicals from the Ford Racing Catalog, and I'm sure someone is selling knock-offs of the interior and exterior trip items. The only thing you can't change is the manufacturer's name on the title. Doesn't the SCCA require you to list the correct make of your stock class car? Don't you need to produce the correct manufacturer's shop manual if you are protested?

I'm sure you're right about the Shelby increasing interest in a moribund class. I'm just irked that my '07 GT was, on paper at least, obsoleted so quickly. Just once I wanted to have a big enough gun to offset my limitations as a driver

Anyway, Happy Thanksgiving!

Donnie Barnes · **Posted:** Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:34 am

Arthur McDonald wrote:

Donnie Barnes wrote:

there are plenty of people who believe you can legally convert a GT to a Shelby GT by getting the right parts.

What do the majority of SEB members believe?

Beats me. I'm just one guy.

Quote:

Sure, you can get all of the mechanicals from the Ford Racing Catalog, and I'm sure someone is selling knock-offs of the interior and exterior trip items. The only thing you can't change is the manufacturer's name on the title. Doesn't the SCCA require you to list the correct make of your stock class car? Don't you need to produce the correct manufacturer's shop manual if you are protested?

You're joking, right? A Ford manual (the car IS still a Ford) along with whatever docs Shelby has should be just fine. I mean, surely the SEB chairman and a lot of other long time SCCA racers didn't race them without proper documentation.

Quote:

I'm sure you're right about the Shelby increasing interest in a moribund class. I'm just irked that my '07 GT was, on paper at least, obsoleted so quickly. Just once I wanted to have a big enough gun to offset my limitations as a driver

Don't take this the wrong way, but as of yet we haven't seen any Shelby GT's at TH events. You running somewhere I don't know about? Besides, you ignored my point that Sam Strano said he doesn't think the Shelby is that much, if any, faster than the normal GT. You really weren't heinously obsoleted.

--Donnie

Todd Breakey · **Posted:** Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:51 am

Arthur McDonald wrote:

Sure, you can get all of the mechanicals from the Ford Racing Catalog, and I'm sure someone is selling knock-offs of the interior and exterior trip items. The only thing you can't change is the manufacturer's name on the title. Doesn't the SCCA require you to list the correct make of your stock class car? Don't you need to produce the correct manufacturer's shop manual if you are protested?

I know of a guy from FL that converted his California Special GT to Shelby GT specs. He was actually mid transformation while at the DC Pro. He went and talked to Strano and they both went to talk to the other FS drivers about his car not quite being a Shelby. No one had an issue with it. He did have a hard time getting some of the parts but he wasn't protested at any event including Nats. Granted he was a backmarker this year, but you know how some people are.

Eric Peterson · **Joined:** Mon Sep 01, 2003 10:24 am **Posts:** 494

I recall reading Sam Strano's posts on sccaforums about the Shelby v. the GT and his back to back tests. The Shelby was 3 tenths faster on a low to mid 40 second course, but Sam said he thought the course was a worst case scenario for the GT. And, he owns an '07 GT and is convinced the car can win.

More importantly and I think a key factor for folks to consider who may be interested in running F Stock in North Carolinia, Sam says the GT slaloms better than the Shelby. Since we have so many airport/transition laden courses it seems like, at the worst, the GT would be an even match for the Shelby at places like Danville, Sanford, and Laurinburg.

I really thought F Stock was dead and maybe should have been eliminated as a class last year b/c the turn out had been so low. I think the Shelby saved F Stock as a class since it was well subscribed and extremely exciting to watch this year. Watching the hot shoes wheel those big cars around the courses is always a blast to see. The new car definitely brought back a lot of A class drivers to F Stock.

If it turns out the more affordable GT and Bullitt versions are closely competitive, then F Stock could turn into a stable class to play in for a long time. Based on Sam's comments it appears the wosrt case scenario will be that the GT will be very competitive at the local, regional, and divisional level...maybe at Nationals, too.

Oh, and since I'm the only one in the club that didn't get to post about the Solstice v. Miata SCCA wars here's my "contribution" :-)

Sorry Donnie, I'm having to side with Chuck on this one, I have actual video tape of the evil Mazda folks trying to slip the MX-5 trunk kits past the SCCA *and* they hit a cone while doing it. The other tape shows the GMPP Solstice folks saving baby seals and attempting to stop global warming early this year, hence the reason GM was so tardy in making the GXP ZOK available to the public. I would post the tapes to uTube, but decided it would be too much for everyone to handle. Therefore, the only logical step was for me to destroy the tapes as a means of protecting everyone. Please, no need to thank me.

Anonymous

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

Donnie,

I'll concede the car origin/documentation argument. :oops:

I just found the Shelby GT listed on the Ford SVT website.

Thank heaven I wasn't "heinously" obsoleted! I guess the reason the Shelby might not be much faster in an autocross setting is that both cars use the same 8" rim width.

Chuck Branscomb · **Posted:** Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:58 pm

Arthur McDonald wrote:

Donnie,

I'll concede the car origin/documentation argument. :oops:

I just found the Shelby GT listed on the Ford SVT website.

Thank heaven I wasn't "heinously" obsoleted! I guess the reason the Shelby might not be much faster in an autocross setting is that both cars use the same 8" rim width.

Art,

Bring me up to date on your autox car(s) and plans. Did you sell the ESP Mustang? Are you planning on running F-stock next year?

David Spratte · **Posted:** Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:26 pm

This thread, ironically, made me go look up the Bullitt specs. There's a part of me that thinks that would be an awfully good time.

Donnie Barnes · **Posted:** Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:31 pm

David Spratte wrote:

This thread, ironically, made me go look up the Bullitt specs. There's a part of me that thinks that would be an awfully good time.

Agreed. Did you find anything on which springs it was going to use? At last check that was the last point of contention that nobody had heard for sure on to know if it would be as good as the Shelby GT or not.

--Donnie

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

Donnie Barnes wrote:

Did you find anything on which springs it was going to use? At last check that was the last point of contention that nobody had heard for sure on to know if it would be as good as the Shelby GT or not.
--Donnie

http://www.fordvehicles.com/assets/pdf/ ... atures.pdf

This fact sheet does not mention different springs. It also doesn't explain why they stole the dashboard facing from a '78 Trans AM. Maybe there's going to be a Bullitt movie remake starring Burt Reynolds?

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

Chuck Branscomb wrote:

Art,

Bring me up to date on your autox car(s) and plans. Did you sell the ESP Mustang? Are you planning on running F-stock next year?

Plan A is to just throw another set of front brakes on the old Mustang and hope the oil pressure doesn't keep dropping. Maybe splurge on BFG R1s, since I still have my old Team T/A magnetics from 1992

I think I'll pass on subframe connectors, even though they're finally allowed. I would have been thrilled to put them in when I went to ESP in 8 years ago, or even a few years later, but now it's just too late.

It would be really fun to autocross the 07, unless I find myself needing to downshift during a run, because I still haven't figured out how to heel-toe the stupid thing. The real inhibitor for me is that it's my good car, everything on it works, and it will be under warrantee for a long time.

I have a 3rd car now. My father gave me his '95 Taurus last week. I'm thinking about running it in the new OF class next year

Todd Breakey · **Posted:** Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:44 am

David Spratte wrote:

This thread, ironically, made me go look up the Bullitt specs. There's a part of me that thinks that would be an awfully good time.

+1

That car has me thinking bad thoughts!!

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:46 am

Todd Breakey wrote:

David Spratte wrote:

This thread, ironically, made me go look up the Bullitt specs. There's a part of me that thinks that would be an awfully good time.

+1

That car has me thinking bad thoughts!!

Until the new Camaro & Challenger are out in a year. Then you have $30,000 invested in an underdog. :shock:

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