THSCC Forums

Time for the Miata to wear something with a higher rubber to steal ratio. I know some you you have tried the Avon Ra's (and suspect somebody tried the Kook 214's), but really couldn't find much for reviews - so anybody want to share? Any comparisons to 710's or the other usual suspects appreciated.

_________________
Dustin Fredrickson
-- I'm a nobody --

I had the Avons and I don't have any empirical evidence, but my impression is that the Avons are probably not as good as the 710s, especially as they age. Grip was really good at first, but fell off quickly. Les may have a better idea, he drives faster than me.

Bryan and I tried the Kook 214's on the RX-8 prior to setting it up (no shocks/exhaust). They gripped well laterally, but gave up a little bit to the 710's longitudinally. They lasted well though and for the local stuff, would be very good. - AB

_________________
'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Based on the tests we did for the Tire Rack and Avon at the end of 2005 and last season (they wanted some feedback to see how the Tech RA performed on several other surfaces in different conditions with hacky drivers ). I found them to be 3 - 6 tenths slower than Hoosier A6s on a 50 second course. Based on testing at the Tire Rack, they found them to be about 3 - 4 tenths slower than A6s. They are closer on asphalt than on concrete. I believe that Tire Rack testing showed that they pulled more lateral G's than the Kumhos and Hoosiers.

The nice thing about the Tech RAs is that they wear really well, work great in the cold, and are hard to overheat (important if you are doing something like an Evo School when you get many back to back runs). Chris P. and I found them to be a good tire, I liked them. They are a bit quirky, very sensitive to pressure changes, and I found it harder to get 10/10ths out of them compared to the Hoosier.

Prior to testing the tires, Chris Harvey at the Tire Rack told me that you really have to "beat" on the tire to get everything out of it - he was right. It was a different feel that took a while to figure out. The sidewall is so stiff that if you drive the car at 95% you "feel" as if you are at the limit and thus don't "feel" like you can push the car anymore. I found (after getting a bit angry and driving harder) that the tire can take a lot of abuse and is progressive. To me, it has a two stage feel on the sidewall flex...when you drive it hard enough it takes its first set when the car leans over, when it's pushed harder it takes second more subtle set (I believe due to the stiff sidewall - though I could be out to lunch on this). Anyway, figuring that out was what allowed to get the time gap much closer to the Hoosiers.

Bottom line is the Avons will be cheaper on a per run basis than the Hoosier and you're not giving up a lot of time, but they are not as easy to drive as Hoosiers or Kumhos. I still think the best "bang for your buck" tire is the Kumho Victoracer V700. I was looking at either buying a set of those or the Hankook Z211 road race tires they are selling for $95/each (ad in this month's grassroots from Hankook dealers) for 205/50-15s. The nice thing is that you can drive to the events on both types of tires.

I've been considering buying something cheaper as well to save money early in the season to help with the diaper and day care fund

Good luck on your decision.

Eric

I should have added that the Miata may be a 3 driver car this year, and I'll be running primarily local stuff only. A6 is likely out of the budget, and I think a progressive, heat tolerant, slightly longer wearing, "sacrifice a few tenths" tire is better suited to my goals, and the learning curve of my new, relatively green, codriver.

_________________
Dustin Fredrickson
-- I'm a nobody --

I never used the RA, I used the earlier model and was quite happy with them. One of their best strengths was putting power down, as for cornering grip, they are closer to v710s than the Victoracers. I have often wondered though if this was due to a less sticky compound, or the fact that they run narrower. I could easily fit 4 225 Avon's on my tire trailer, to fit the 225 V710, require modification, and the 225 A6 even more. I think the relative narrowness could explain the speed difference. Other than that I'd confirm basically what Eric said. The Avon is very good at handling temperature extremes, both cold and hot. They also like lots of pressure, upper 40s or even 50 psi. They will also drop off significantly in grip before they actually cord. Of course my experience was with the Tech R, not the RA so it might be different in some ways.

Dustin, I forgot one important piece of information about the Avon Tech RA, I found it was easier to lock the brakes up with them than other tires. This is of course a problem with the right fronts on the Miata. I think it's because the sidewalls are so stiff that it is harder to modulate the brakes...the old BFG GForces were similiar. It's just harder to "feel" what the car is doing brake-wise with the Avons than other tires. It's not a horrible problem, but something you definitely want to be aware of *especially* with a green co-driver!

The good news is we never put any huge flat spots on the tires, but did have some pretty decent lock-up episodes. As an aside, one of the keys to going fast is braking as little as possible, though when I decide to use the brakes I really hammer them and thus may be more prone to lock-up than others.

Thanks, a good point regardless, but a little less of a "problem" for me since my Miata LS has ABS

_________________
Dustin Fredrickson
-- I'm a nobody --

I noticed an ad on page 86 of the April SportsCar for a closeout on Hankook Z211s. East Coast distributor is Frisby Tire, 1-800-798-7201
http://www.frisbyracetire.com/z211sale.html

_________________
Art McDonald
Premier Amateur #518
2008 Dishman Cup
Pivot Cone Snob

Rodney is a waxer (but in a good way)

Dustin, let me know how you like them. I just noticed that ad for Hankooks as well - of course, about a week after I ordered the Hoo$iers...

_________________
Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)

I have a set on my car which I'll have at Greenville. I'll have to remind my green co-driver about the brake issue so he is careful. I don't have ABS only ABFoot which doesn't always intervene when it should

Mine have no AX runs on them, but do have about 100 miles of track day at Roebling.

Rob

I looked at the discount Kook 211's, but after exchanging email with Frisby a couple times, the 211 sounds to be a bit less AutoX friendly than the 214 version which has a bit more following. For the $30/tire delta, I chose the Avons instead. I'm still feeling the Avon's out, but so far I'm happy.

_________________
Dustin Fredrickson
-- I'm a nobody --