Course Worker Issues

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 10:41 am

jimpastorius wrote:

Why not switch things up a little and have stock run 2 and 4? Why should one group be stuck working 4th heat for the last 5 years?

Damn, something I agree with Jim P. on. :shock:

We will make this so at the next event. If for some reason it's not remembered, remind me please.

Bernie Baake · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 10:47 am

Vincent Keene wrote:

Not to slight Brice's concerns or other workers who pulled a longer shift, but being the WC is *the* worst job in the club IMO. If you think it's not, volunteer to do it next season and you'll be surprised.

Thank you Vincent. I wasn't going to respond to this but for what its worth here's my take on the subject. When I took this job I knew I would get flak in someway, shape or form. I've got broad shoulders I can take it.

Brice I sent you out when you reported in because I can't take the time to round everyone up twice to man the workers stations... Once when you sign in and again when you go to man the station. Oft times I've had to search the pit areas and the work stations to find the folks who are supposed to be working!!! As it is there are a fair number of folks who need to be rounded up to sign the work assignment sheets. The inequity in the work assignments is an unfortunate circumstance but the alternatives are equally unpleasant and time and labor intensive.
As you become more familiar with the running of the autox's you'll know when to report and man the stations. B grid should be running when you check in and B grid should still be running when you man the work station

Working in my estimation is a privilege, it means you are doing your part to insure the operation of the event and ultimately the success of the club which you are a part of. Without the work there is no autox. Brice you helped yesterday and it is appreciated and I hope this incident will not deter your enthusiasm. If everyone strove to do more the club would benefit greatly too many folks are looking for the easy way out. don't fall into that crowd. It should not be precieved as punishment to work hard for the club.

As Vincent said an even easier job would be to take the work coordinators job.. that way you could work all day and never get to spend time with your wife.

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

Bernie, read my past posts, I've more than acknowledged that the worker coordinator did a fabulous job. I'm merely trying to help make the system more friendly to those who are new to things (this is my 8th auto-x, I KINDA know how things run, just pointing out how we might make things better as even the slightly experienced can make a mistake). Sorry if I stepped on your toes man, but calm down. I'M NOT UNHAPPY and I'm NOT CRITICIZING YOU. I just see a way that we might make things easier in the future so that others don't get themselves in the same position I did.

Bernie Baake · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:14 am

BriceJohnson wrote:

Bernie, read my past posts, I've more than acknowledged that the worker coordinator did a fabulous job. I'm merely trying to help make the system more friendly to those who are new to things (this is my 8th auto-x, I KINDA know how things run, just pointing out how we might make things better as even the slightly experienced can make a mistake). Sorry if I stepped on your toes man, but calm down. I'M NOT UNHAPPY and I'm NOT CRITICIZING YOU. I just see a way that we might make things easier in the future so that others don't get themselves in the same position I did.

Brice I'm not angry or upset. I also know as WC I will not be able to please everyone. It is what it is our job is to get people out to the work stations in a timely fashon, sorry if you felt it was too early. It was you who said you felt you were punished, there was no malice on my part in sending you out when you checked in. As I said in the previous post your work helped make the event a success.

Richard Casto · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:15 am

scottjohnson wrote:

You checked in to work, but you also chose to go out early....

....After checking in to work, you could have wandered over to the grid person and asked, "How many runs have the cars in lane B taken?" If the answer was "None" then you head back to your pit space for some water and rest. After a little while you report to work.

I have learned the hard way that this is what you should do. I worked 3rd heat, so I ran "A" in 2nd, finished my runs, put car back in pit, walked to check in with Bernie but then realized that "B" had not even started yet. At this point I realized I had forgot my water, went back to pit, got water went back and hung out in the shade with Bernie until the "B" line started. Then went out. I still went out "on time" and maybe a bit early as I worked all of "B" for 2 and both "A" and "B" of 3. I stayed out as station 3 was swamped.

Chris Brown · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:30 am

dang...i was hoping to squash this with my first post...i come back from a meeting and ka-boom

brice, we hear ya loud and clear. i know you aren't blaming the wc's just the process, and we are all ears to suggestions. i like the idea of the wheel, but at sites like lo'burg and sanford, it might not be as effective.

in the past we have been burned with workers not showing up on time, and we had to hold the event for changes. that's not fun for anyone, so i guess we started calling for workers earlier and earlier. plus, bernie and i aren't exactly shy people, so i'm sure we are quite vocal on the intercom.

i'll make an effort (and i'm sure bernie will to) to call for workers a little later then normal. we will run the risk of leaving people out later than they should so if that doesn't seem to do the trick, we can explore other options.

does that sound like a reasonable plan?

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:37 am

Chris Brown wrote:

dang...i was hoping to squash this with my first post...i come back from a meeting and ka-boom

brice, we hear ya loud and clear. i know you aren't blaming the wc's just the process, and we are all ears to suggestions. i like the idea of the wheel, but at sites like lo'burg and sanford, it might not be as effective.

in the past we have been burned with workers not showing up on time, and we had to hold the event for changes. that's not fun for anyone, so i guess we started calling for workers earlier and earlier. plus, bernie and i aren't exactly shy people, so i'm sure we are quite vocal on the intercom.

i'll make an effort (and i'm sure bernie will to) to call for workers a little later then normal. we will run the risk of leaving people out later than they should so if that doesn't seem to do the trick, we can explore other options.

does that sound like a reasonable plan?

Eliminate the signing up for specific worker stations :-)

If you are late, off the the netherlands you go. So you will always have those that are late relieving one another.

I would like to state, that no one has a harder job than anyone else the day of an event. In fact, the people working heat 4 have the toughest of all jobs. The good ones are out there the longest and then they all pitch in the clean up the course! Of all the jobs I have done in this club, that is the one job I really dislike.

Rick Butters · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:45 am

Another possible help would be to have three announcements for each worker session, perhaps 5 minutes apart.
"first call for heat 2 workers" means you have 15 mintues to be at station
"second call for heat 2 workers" means you have 10 minutes to be at station
"third and final call for heat 2 workers" means you have 5 minutes to be at station
5 minutes later you re too late.

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:52 am

Rick Butters wrote:

5 minutes later you're too late.

...and what happens then? We stop the event until you can make it to work? :stick:

Jason Mauldin · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 11:54 am

Vincent Keene wrote:

Rick Butters wrote:

5 minutes later you're too late.

...and what happens then? We stop the event until you can make it to work? :stick:

You find someone who will help you out and you move on. Don't allow the offending party back.

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 12:01 pm

Vincent Keene wrote:

Rick Butters wrote:

5 minutes later you're too late.

...and what happens then? We stop the event until you can make it to work? :stick:

I can never remember where we stopped an event because of workers being late. I do remember where we have had workers out there for almost double heats (last year at Laurinburg).

And it is only really an issue at the Laurinburg site, late in the year when we run the large course. So far, we have had plenty of workers per station.

One option, DQ their fastest run of the day. What is the price for someone not being considerate to their fellow competitor and making that person stand out there in the blazing sun an extra 15 minutes or so?

I think Rick's suggestion has a lot merit. Provide 10 minute, 5 minute and now announcements for worker check in.

MikeWhitney · **Joined:** Wed Aug 20, 2003 9:15 pm **Posts:** 4724

BriceJohnson wrote:

The "Mike Whitney" approach is what leads to the unneccesarily early calls for workers, b/c it causes people to try and wait it out until the last minute to minimize their time working. The "scottjohnson" approach suggests that you take worker coordinator statements to be merely suggestions.

Some quick math for a typical event:

120 drivers,
60 each in Group 1 and 2, so 30 cars in A and B.
2 runs
30 sec launch interval.

B line *should* take 30 minutes in this case. A first call for workers at the start of B line at -30 minutes is about right

2nd run, when cars start to disappear, would be at -15 minutes. Good time for a second call for workers.

The difference yesterday was the 3 runs which added 50% to those numbers. And typically a run group takes more like 1:15 or 1:30 even with 2 runs.

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Mon May 22, 2006 12:38 pm

MikeWhitney wrote:

The difference yesterday was the 3 runs which added 50% to those numbers. And typically a run group takes more like 1:15 or 1:30 even with 2 runs.

True. So you could say that the heat 3 and 4 workers got "shafted" due to the extra afternoon runs added. If this is going to be a huge deal (not that it is) we can eliminate that extra run so it would be more "fair" to everyone.

Of course if we need to be fair to everyone regarding the time spent working for the club, quite a few of us (especially the officers) are in the hole BIG TIME.

Like Brad and a few others have said, lots of time and work is put in to make this club and it's events what it is today. Just for a little perspective Brice, you worked 2 hours yesterday. Mike and others put well over 100 hours into the bus and trailer we all now enjoy.

MikeWhitney · **Joined:** Wed Aug 20, 2003 9:15 pm **Posts:** 4724

Vincent Keene wrote:

True. So you could say that the heat 3 and 4 workers got "shafted" due to the extra afternoon runs added. If this is going to be a huge deal (not that it is) we can eliminate that extra run so it would be more "fair" to everyone.

Nooooo!

I'd rather revert to the idea of kicking anyone out of the club that complains without offering a concrete and well-thought-out suggestion for improvement

IMO Brice HAS made a concrete and well-thought-out suggestion, it's just one that many people don't agree with!

For the record, more runs + more work is FINE with me. I was just stating fact with the numbers above. Just want to make sure no one misconstrues my comments above as containing any opinion whatsoever.

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

The lesson learned here, don't try to enact any positive change that helps out novices/new people, everyone will just call you a whiner. . .

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