"The Big Easy - Great Event! (almost!)

Chuck Frank · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 1:51 pm

We break the course into "elements" sections that do not require specific set-up or transitional line adjustments. Next we identify the key cones, mentally eliminating any cones that do not affect the line and what basic element or shape those key cones form. From that we "name the sections using a name that reminds us of the shape of the line and/or the key cones. Often times we will use a "theme" for the names as a memory aid.
For example Nationals south course this year used a snack foods theme (guess we were hungry during the course walks...) We don't usually name the first element since it is obvious from the start. So the south course became peanut brittle turn, slimjim, turn into tripple cheese doodle, double taffy turns, sweep into the hershey highway, turn into the licorice whip, then puke (the finish). Only seven elements to remember, and I could diagram that entire course right now even though there were over 450 cones on course! This system also helps us when we are critquing each other's runs because we both can immediately identify what part of the course we are talking about, and can talk openly without cluing in another competitor: "You broke late turning into the whip." "Take a tighter line around the first taffy turn", etc. We also use the memory aids to form mental pictures of the actual cones rather than remembering it as a line drawn on a course map. Before we developed this system, we would spend 3-4 hrs making dozens of course walks until dark or the officials forced us off the course. Now we will typically do 3-4 afternoon course walks and one more in the morning to reinforce the mental pictures and make sure there weren't any changes made.
It was a blessing this year at nationals we were starting Tues on the South course, so we concentrated on that course Monday, and walked the North course just once to familiarize ourselves with it's basic design so we would know what they were talking about at Mon eve's annual Evolution course analysis seminar. Tues had a 2-1/2 hr severe weather start delay, and word came from the north course that a large section of pavement there had broken up so badly they had to redesign a portion of the course when repairs could not be made between the first and second run group.
The heats ran so late that the south course finished near dusk and the north course didn't even finish all the second last run group or any of the last rungroup before it was stopped because of darkness. By this time it was very dark and < 1/2 hr before the gates would be locked so there were no eve walkthrus, and the announcement came that they would finish Tues north course runs Wed AM starting at 7:30. Daybreak in Topeka that day was a few minutes before 7:00, so we were going to have no more than 20 minutes of daylight to walk and learn a redesigned course we hadn't seen (larger of the two courses!) before we would run it. (Donna ran in heat 2!) That meant one full and maybe 1 partial walk thru only, and we hadn't even named the elements yet. Fortunately the new course design simplified the course some so we concentrated on the key elements and named those, squeezing in almost 2 full but very fast walk thrus on a crowded course. There were no more walk thrus before the 1st Wed heat started close to 10:00. One of the ESL drivers in the first heat got so lost she stopped and asked a course worker for directions!

Wes Eargle · **Joined:** Mon Oct 27, 2003 9:47 am **Posts:** 3683

Chuck Frank wrote:

sweep into the hershey highway

You owe my company a new keyboard now thanks to the Diet Dr. Pepper that I just sprayed into it.

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

Keith Q - I had trouble downshifting in Rich's car because his brake pedal was soft - I think it's worn wheel bearings knocking the pads back. I ended up just having to brake, clutch in, put the shifter in 2nd & let out the clutch pedal & jerk a little, because the pedal was at different heights almost every time I hit the brakes. :lol:

Driving smooth & maintaining momentum in 3rd through the medium-tight spots worked pretty well to avoid bogging. Only place I bogged was coming out of the pivot cone turn.

Dan D - (or is that Dandy? :lol:

) Engine mounts are pretty weak on the STi, but you can get STi Group N rally car engine mounts. I've heard the tranny mount is already the Group N rally mount, though.

Also Dandy - I thought I already taught you the "smooth hack" method at Greenville?

Chris Landi · **Joined:** Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:31 pm **Posts:** 579

Keith Quistorff wrote:

Les Davis wrote:

My car is so hard to get into 3rd, I really have to want it to go there, to take the chance. I wasted alot of time making that shift, with all the grinding and whatnot. I swear if my car would shift easily into 3rd, I would have been at least a couple tenths faster and maybe wouldn't have been beaten by a girl. :wink:

My car shifts from 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 2nd perfectly fine during normal driving, but those shifts get extremely difficult for me at autocrosses. Wish I could blame the tranny, it's really just my pee-sized brain having problems processing the mechanics of those 2-3-2 shifts along with the other inputs it's getting. :shock:

The 'right' gear for Sunday's course in my STi would have required the following shifts: 1-2-3-2-3-2-3-2-3-2. Not sure how the other guys in STi's dealt with it, but I tried different combinations of riding the rev limiter in 2nd (instead of the first and/or third 3rd gear shifts) and also just leaving it in 3rd (instead of the third and/or fourth 2nd gear shifts) and bogging through the slower sections. If only I had a gear that was halfway between 2nd and 3rd . . . :lol:

I have no issue shifting up or down, even to first. I tried one variation of 1-2-3-2-3-2-3-2 type stuff and found that I was grabbing the shifter as much as the steering wheel. I then ran in 2'nd all the way through and pretty much stuck with that from there on. In hindsight, I should have done a lot more -3-. My minor victory was doing successful 2nd gear pivots

DanDurusky · **Joined:** Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:31 pm **Posts:** 686

Kevin, yeh you did and it sure worked that day. i think i've since lost the magic, though. i felt real hackish on sunday and i'm still not happy about it. i got faster as i went, but it was a more brute force attack i don't feel like i did it "right". it coulda/shoulda been a lot smoother and faster

Patrice Bousquet · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:32 pm

Now you all experiencing what I have to deal with at every autocross, going to 3rd and back to 2nd all the time. Fun isn't it !!!!
That probably help me with the Miata. On the 1st run I stay in 2nd but did way too much rev. limiter on the fast part near the end.
The next 3 run I shifted in 3rd without any problem.

Patrice

Keith Quistorff · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:44 pm

Kevin Allen wrote:

Keith Q - I had trouble downshifting in Rich's car because his brake pedal was soft - I think it's worn wheel bearings knocking the pads back. I ended up just having to brake, clutch in, put the shifter in 2nd & let out the clutch pedal & jerk a little, because the pedal was at different heights almost every time I hit the brakes. :lol:

Driving smooth & maintaining momentum in 3rd through the medium-tight spots worked pretty well to avoid bogging. Only place I bogged was coming out of the pivot cone turn.

Yeah, my fastest lap was when I just left it in 3rd through the entire middle section of the course and let it bog. The worst bog, at the zig-zag section, was just painfully slow-feeling in 3rd, but downshifting to 2nd there required another upshift and downshift again just to get to the finish.

I'm finding heel-and-toe to be very 'un-natural' feeling in my STi, while it's almost 'automatic' in my BMW or Scott Chastain's S2000 - not sure if it's the brake pad knock-back issue w/04 STi's or the pedal spacing.

AdamBreakey · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:45 pm

Chuck Frank wrote:

We break the course into "elements" sections that do not require specific set-up or transitional line adjustments. Next we identify the key cones, mentally eliminating any cones that do not affect the line and what basic element or shape those key cones form.

Chuck - I have a similar approach to course walks. I am not quite as creative in my naming however. Although, I will say that I do use food items to name a few elements - like a Cheeto wall. I tend to stick with the same name from course to course, instead of your themed approach. My South Course from Nats this year went like this:

start -right, box, box, sweep right, wallom, left, wallom left, wallom left, sweep it big right (trust the grip), then sweep it big left (quick), turn it right, up the hill (throttle early), bend left, GO FAST, 90 degree left sweep slalom to a sweeper left finish. --- All the while yelling at myself from in the car -- LOOK AHEAD -- LOOK AHEAD.

Tim Aro has been invaluable to me this year as far as instruction. He has tought me so much about the feel of the car at the limit and how to prepare your mind for your next run. I owe my good showing at the ProFinale to him, Chris Ramey and Jean Kinser Dana.

man this is a great sport.

and BTW, you have my wonderful class (SS) to blame for destroying the north course on Tuesday.

adamb

Chuck Frank · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:45 pm

Wes Eargle wrote:

Chuck Frank wrote:

sweep into the hershey highway

You owe my company a new keyboard now thanks to the Diet Dr. Pepper that I just sprayed into it.

Yes! it was a "drag" race straightaway! :wink:

Les Davis · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 2:04 pm **Posts:** 2059

Brian Herring wrote:

Les Davis wrote:

Brian Herring wrote:

MikeWhitney wrote:

So how fast would I have been going if I had shifted? :twisted:

mid-65 seconds and near top of third (77 - 80 mph).

- dow

Well, I'm not sure he would have hit 77 mph, maybe if he had gone to third and somehow kept it matted until the hard right at the end of the runway, but I don't think thats possible. I did manage to get it into third there for my final run and I *might* have cracked 70 before lifiting a couple times in the "box of confusion" before the hard right. I finally had to go into third there because I was on the rev limiter 2nd (63 mph) for so long on my third run, I ended up lifting a few times in the straight just to save the abuse to the engine. On my second run I tried going into third for basically the whole course after the first turn around all the way to the hard right at the end of the runway, but that result was less than optimal power delivery in many spots on the course. My car is so hard to get into 3rd, I really have to want it to go there, to take the chance. I wasted alot of time making that shift, with all the grinding and whatnot. I swear if my car would shift easily into 3rd, I would have been at least a couple tenths faster and maybe wouldn't have been beaten by a girl. :wink:

No, I am fairly confident he coulda hit mid 70s easy. He was already hitting the limiter before he got through the second set of double cone slaloms. Mid 70s on V710s shoulda been doable. I hit the top of 3rd's limiter.

That's just my though as he has more lateral grip from the 710s and he would be able to stay in it longer and use more of his grip to get more speed. He was on the limiter for a good 4-5 seconds.

- dow

Ps. Whitney -- When are you going to make that M3 and STU M3?

Well, this is kinda a silly argument and I don't really want to drag it out. You have a point, but your car and my car both accellerate faster than Mike's car. Now since its Mike, he was probably carrying more speed out of that slalom than you or I, but that straight just wasn't that long, it takes a good bit of time to accelerate from 64-77 mph, even in an M3. However, if I hadn't spent 2 seconds trying to get my darn car in third, I suppose I could have hit mid 70s. So maybe your right.

Chuck Frank · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:04 pm

We never plan the themes, they just seem to develop. Ayer tour day 2 used a fishing theme, last year So course was a drive thru town and countryside, Fed Ex tour was an amusment park, etc. Not all courses end up being "themed" tho. Sunday's course was named by elements and direction in: sweep, 2 (cone slallom) easy, pivot, 2 easy, 2 easy, lane, diagonal 3 hard, double humpty bump, double diagonal, over to left, over to right, over to left, sweep to finish.

AdamBreakey · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:08 pm

Chuck Frank wrote:

double humpty bump.

who doesn't like a double humpty bump? :lol:

I like the themed approach, especially for two driver cars. You can easily say when you get back from your run, I blew it on the second cheeto highway... watch your entrance speed.

Of course, this sort of information is only valuable if you and your co-driver are very familiar with the car and each other's driving style. Otherwise getting that sort of tip could cause one to be too cautious in an element. it is a delicate balance.

adamb

Les Davis · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 2:04 pm **Posts:** 2059

Matt McGrain wrote:

Either way, hitting the rev limiter at close to 9000 rpm twice in a single run translates into a fun course anyday in my book.

Try 5 times. :wink:

Of course your car may top out higher in 2nd than mine. Yeah, that Danville event/course was indeed a blast.

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:20 pm

Les Davis wrote:

However, if I hadn't spent 2 seconds trying to get my darn car in third...

I've never had this problem (2 to 5) in ANY car I've driven. The Miata shifter is pretty good IMO (compared to the Talon, CRX, and my Z-24) so I'm puzzled here. However when using the "death grip" (fingers and hand fully griping the shift knob) I've found it very easy to go 2-1 instead of 2-3 even at 50MPH in the Miata. Open the hand, let the heel of your palm do the shift, and 3rd is almost impossible to miss when going 2 to 3.

Wes Eargle · **Joined:** Mon Oct 27, 2003 9:47 am **Posts:** 3683

Les's tranny is teh crappay compared to mine for whatever reason, even when driven back-to-back.

THSCC Forums

"The Big Easy - Great Event! (almost!)

Who is online