THSCC Forums

Does anybody have any experience with the MK1 MR2? I know I’ve seen one or two at a Tarheel event awhile back but I can’t remember who owned them. Can the owners share any thoughts?

I’ve been toying with the idea of playing around with one and I’m having trouble seeing the big downside(s?). On paper, they look to be competitive with a Miata or CRX but I know nobody runs them seriously at a national level-- at least not that I’ve seen yet. They weigh about the same as a Miata (1.6L) and have similar power specs. From the dyno graphs I’ve seen, they are a little gutless on the bottom end but so is a Miata. Even the gearing looks to be fairly similar so I’m wondering if they might be competitive in STS2.

Is there something truly evil in the handling department that only comes out when driven hard? If so, is that something you can tune out with an aftermarket suspension? Is it simply a case of the car being less than the sum of it’s parts where the Miata seems to be more? Or is all this moot anyway and will the CRX totally dominate the class??? Damn you Ryan!

A friend of a friend is looking to sell his in a couple of months (December timeframe) and I’ve considered picking it up. The price is right (read: dirt cheap) and the car seems to be in decent condition.

Any thoughts?

Jim
- always looking to do something a little different...

Great...Someone else to beat me in STS2!!!

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Todd Breakey
STS 42 - 1992 Sunburst Miata
Dammit!
"You souldn't play leap frog with a porcupine. You might get hurt." - Eliza

I bet it's a good choice. Good weight distribution, decent power and very light. It could be entertaining. Although the CRX is a good car, I don't think it will be the car to have like the Civic Si in STS. I think it's initial setup will be easy because the Civic Si shares the same parts (from the '88-'91 models), but that may only be an initial advantage. I would be all over Wes' Miata for STS2, and the 1st gen MR2 is very intresting. - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Yeah Wes's car would be ideal, too bad AFAIK it has a Torsen and is currently ineligible for STS2

Jim, there is alot more to the equation than just the car. You got SKILLZZ, I got none

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02 Focus SVT
STF 9

Jim has been racing alcohol burning shifter carts since he was 2 1/2 though. That's gotta help alot.

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2006 Civic Si - #24 HS for 2015

2005 GMC Sierra
1991 318is Garage Ornament

Actually, he can run it in STS2, he just needs to remove the diff, which I would save for track events. Swapping a diff on that car is pretty fast, probably around 3/4 - 1 hour. - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Mark Senior has a Gen 1 Mr2 doesn't (didn't) he?

I think he still does, but it's the supercharged version, which I think would be put on an exclusion list if you tried it. - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

The only knock I see on that first gen MR2 is difficulty in servicing and availability of cheap performance parts. On the service difficulty, well, it's a TINY car with the engine shoved in the rear. I've heard horror stories about getting to stuff on it. That said, it may not be horrible if you're used to working on front drivers.

How much is available for it on the aftermarket parts front, though? Is it a strut car? If so, getting adjustable shocks and aftermarket springs that will go on it may be a good bit steeper. Don't know about other parts, really.

I know Ashraf Farrag had one or two parts cars for sale on the for sale board here, though he either quit trying or he sold them. You might check as they were dirt cheap and if you had a place to store them they might come in handy.


--Donnie

Stock weight per an old R&T for an early MR2 is about 2350 and the stock hp is 112 from 1.6L. With a strut suspension (likely) it may be very hard to match the handling of a similar size and power to weight Miata (assuming the ST legal mods don't allow a much bigger power increase for the MR2 than for the Miata 1.6).

I doubt from my mid engine experience (Lotus Europa) that it would be enough to overcome the Miata's likely other advantages in a low power class.

Second comment, why is a limited slip a big deal in a Miata for open track use? How much wheelspin can you get on a race track given great handling, big radius turns (compared to autocrossing) and hardly any power?

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Dick Rasmussen

FS 50 2018 Mustang GT

I ran a crappy looking green 85 MR2 mkI last year. Great car for auto-x.
strut suspension, front and rear sway bars, they need urethane badly...lotsa flex. The cars have to be driven hard to perform. The rear end will come around hard if you let up in a turn. They are easier to drive than 911s though. THey will push around tight slow turns. It took me some gettnig used to....
The Toyotas are well made and reliable...but the parts are expensive. You have to go to the dealership for everything. I have read that the engine's bottom end is good for 10,000 rpm. The rest is not. They have a variable single/double intake runner set up that kicks in all intake runners @ 4700 rpm...nice little kick in the pants there. The engine pulls well from 4700 up to 8,000 rpm. The transaxles are prone to shifter trouble...often caused by a dragging clutch...not the synchros. The shifter is notchy anyway. They really need a limited slip diff carrier....only the supercharged 88s had LS. The LS tranny is $2000 to fix or replace.

Ohhh yes....dont forget about the miles of water pipes running from rear to front and back....911s only have to worry about oil pipes....water causes rust oil does not. cooling system has many "high spots" there are @ least 4 air bleed points. If you have a leaky cooling system...the engine will not run without boiling. the oil cooler is mounted in the engine bay and is a water/oil cooler. the coolers are known to leak and are often removed.....I wonder if they really need the thing anyway.
The front and rear brake discs were improved in 86....slightly larger and thicker. They are vented front and pancake rear discs. The brakes are prone to warping.....The lugs absolutely must be tightened in a cross pattern to 75ft/lbs no more no less....or they WILL warp the first time someone screws that up.
I lowered my MR2 1.5 inches and was still able to align it to factory specs.

I happen to know where an 88 SC sits right now.

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Paint don't make it go any faster.

Thanks for the input guys.

Here are the specs I’ve gathered (mostly from autotrader.com which I’ve found to be fairly accurate):

1985 MR2
HP: 112 @ 6600rpm
TQ: 97 @ 4800rpm
Curb Weight 2,250
Wheelbase 91.3
Overall Length 154.5
Vehicle Height 49.2
Vehicle Width 65.6

1990 Miata
HP: 116 @ 6500rpm
TQ: 100 @ 5500rpm
Curb Weight 2,182
Wheelbase 89.2
Overall Length 155.4
Vehicle Height 48.2
Vehicle Width 65.9

1994 Miata
HP: 128 @ 6500rpm
TQ: 110 @ 5000rpm
Curb Weight 2,293
Wheelbase 89.2
Overall Length 155.4
Vehicle Height 48.2
Vehicle Width 65.9

1989 CRX Si
HP: 108 @ 6000rpm
TQ: 100 @ 5000rpm
Curb Weight 2,156
Wheelbase 90.6
Overall Length 147.8
Vehicle Height 50.1
Vehicle Width 65.7

Although I'm not really interested in the CRX due to its FDW layout, I included a version of it for the heck of it. On paper, it looks like the '94 Miata might be a winner but that may depend on how well the 4AGE engine in the MR2 responds to simple IHE bolt-ons. I know the Miata doesn't gain much from those mods mostly due to the stock ecu. Considering the "chip" market for the Miata is pretty much nil, you're not going to pick up a great deal in the motor department.

Anybody (Scott???) know how well the 4AGE motor responds to mods? It seems like there are a few options for custom chips in the ecu and even without going that route, the ecu seems fairly flexible in its own right. Anybody have any good information about that?

The MR2 may not be a match chassis-wise on paper against the Miata but struts don't seem to hurt the 2nd gen much. It's hard to believe the 2nd gen MR2 weighing 350+lbs more than a 1.6L Miata is beating it around a course just based on its (admittedly fairly large) torque advantage.

About the only thing that jumps out at me about the above stats is the 1.8L Miata's power advantage and the fact that the CRX sure is a stubby little fellow.

Sometimes I really hate thinking about cars...

Jim

I don't think the 4AG responds too well until you start changing cams. It's a flapper door AFM just like the miata. I suppose you owuld get a little from a CAI and probably a decent gain from a header, but not much more.

IMHO the reason the MR2 never did that well in stock class were the skinny wheels, 14x5.5 or something of that nature. You can fix that problem in STS.

You might check out club4ag for engine mods and expected gains.

Scott

As Jim had posted, and as I said earlier, forget a first gen Miata with a VLSD for STS2 if you're going to run the car Nationally. All of these cars can win on the local level, but the extra grunt of the 1.8L Miatas may be an advantage, for I bet the weight differential between that and a 1.6L when in STS2 trim might be 20#. - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Actually the weight you list here is with AC. Without AC the CRX should weigh in at about 2080. My goal is to have my CRX down to 19xx lbs



BLASPHEMY!!!

Why in the hell has it taken SCCA SOOOOOOOOOOOOO long to get a class like this running? Hell since its introduction, nearly every freakin' THSCC'er has been drooling over building a car for this class! All the big guns talking about building a car for it has me eyeing CSP

NAHHHH, I dont want no stinkin' race tires to fuss with.....

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02 Focus SVT
STF 9