Sept autox at Cary

Patrice Bousquet · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:11 am

Well, if it is on YouTube it cannot be more public than that.

edit: Ok it is not that public.
" This video is unlisted. Be considerate and think twice before sharing. "

Chuck Branscomb · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 10:41 am

Arthur McDonald wrote:

Vincent Keene wrote:

Damn. I guess it's cold, but I don't really feel sorry for someone who can afford a car with $4K wheels, but not the skill to keep it off a curb. Of course being able to afford more car than you have talent is not exactly breaking news.

I did feel sorry for the driver, but then I saw the look on his face when he returned to the paddock. He flopped down in chair, leaned back to look at the sky, and then put his hands over his face. Besides the wheel, there's a chance of suspension damage, and I think George P noticed damage to the lower body.

The Pilot Sport 2s on the car looked pretty worn when I saw it in the grid earlier. I think a tire with little/no tread is dicier to drive on marbles - the pebbles and bits of rubber have nowhere to go. And there were definitely marbles on the periphery of that sweeper by the 4th heat.

Furthermore unfortunately for him is the fact that if his car is insured in NC, he has zero insurance coverage per the mandatory policy we all have here now. His company may allow the claim -- who knows, but most companies would not. If he claims it didn't happen at an autocross and instead on a public road (not that he will, just sayin'...), well, the value of the claim would make that felony insurance fraud. He'll probably have to eat the cost of repairs.

Chad Culbertson · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:20 am

I think if I were to buy a GT350R, I would pull those wheels off and sell them and use a small portion of the money to buy a nice set of alloys, lol.

Steven Spampinato · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:33 am

Hey guys, after a car takes a hit like that, did anyone re-tech. That BMW looked like the caster was changing when he stopped in front of me on the way back to grid.
A hit like that kills lower control arms and compliance bushings. Now before you nerd me out by stating what type of front suspension design is on a z4, it looked sketchy. If my car took a hit like that, I would pack it up for the day. As far as the accidents go, both drivers did not brake heading into that turn. Especially the 350R. I watched it from behind. No brake lights at all. Shit happens and Matt McGrain is right, less shit happens at our events because we worry like this. This is good. But...did anyone re-tech the BMW?

Matthew Ryan · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:59 am

I dunno, I see some brake lights in the video

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 12:09 pm

Matt McGrain wrote:

The fellow in the Z4 was intentionally drifting the sweeper and the Mustang guy told me his foot got stuck under the brake pedal FWIW.

The Mustang curb hit video looks consistent with a delay getting to the brake. Per my data/video on the second lap of my best run I lifted at the gate prior to the final gate of the "straight". Total braking zone was about 75 feet for 1.5 seconds. Speed went from about 48 to about 26 mph. The brake pedal in the 2015 GT's is pretty high compared to the gas pedal and I have learned that it is important to "lift" rather than just "pivot" my foot even with racing shoes. I've had a few close calls with the pedal in the two seasons of autocrossing it so I'm not surprised that this could happen to a new to the car and new autocrosser.

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 12:32 pm

Here is a spectator view of my car which includes that section.

https://youtu.be/RBBc8D9t7VU

Matthew Ryan · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 12:42 pm

How are you analyzing the timings like that?

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 1:20 pm

Matthew Ryan wrote:

How are you analyzing the timings like that?

I use Race Technology Analysis. Data and Video are from their DL1 and Video4. Data is automatically sync'd to video.

screenshot below if I did this correctly

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/llGOPb-HWCFgcY8I5fiSXTVlps9ORr3SWhyD8h6Fw9K7BFYshil2_ztn4VnWaZz5rMPAYMg7lRdzqDt0reSUhoRsr-pL5SdG-6bMpcSGh06Myr2d0p8Z_E5vmxRx6jSmim2LNrRVRuo6B5LPiJqESTM0Bh3WMFZ17H4PNFXHnZJChSLmf9tdBLhoRX84izMVNb5U4x-boz6zh9O6zlWRj140NCYGyoHOVDsoGl1lblS5YNv3j9tAIXCPE0ryoJNWdiiZJuKKxGx1tTTszxBWHifZYURme1BnlL4l6qRLhVMUFYdDu4obhFZ_bpddWrvotkbaydCdelDEgQYefaQHNoersmE9e4MiSgrWGojHR0OTId7BBlpjb_zWgqs5m2xd45mDQ2tAfix3NEDzl3tQzInI_yC8rCGwGiEOuufxdcFlu_n6A6g-klbZXK-DTzrU_YHrmvGtCAh_MBE1L6k1WUwDuz2Rqfhntha-LEy3KsYYXjo_ftZcHIwgw9fZYd9r39RidJGpExuGbuwS0GC7gzSq8uL_apUtHJPDTAD-Pu1o3KCoJ9k0UedTQ4tbiv7tgcJeWlZucqc8jdk29MWfRMLJ99K8RBpYmDzHpqCahjDd4y6-Qg=w1163-h894-no

Chad Culbertson · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 1:21 pm

Steven Spampinato wrote:

Hey guys, after a car takes a hit like that, did anyone re-tech. That BMW looked like the caster was changing when he stopped in front of me on the way back to grid.
A hit like that kills lower control arms and compliance bushings. Now before you nerd me out by stating what type of front suspension design is on a z4, it looked sketchy. If my car took a hit like that, I would pack it up for the day. As far as the accidents go, both drivers did not brake heading into that turn. Especially the 350R. I watched it from behind. No brake lights at all. Shit happens and Matt McGrain is right, less shit happens at our events because we worry like this. This is good. But...did anyone re-tech the BMW?

99% sure the answer is no to that question. I didn't even know what car it was until sometime after it happened, and somebody mentioned a car hitting the curb.

Neal Harrington · **Joined:** Thu Sep 04, 2003 4:29 pm **Posts:** 106

IMHO, the only dangerous section of the course has not been mentioned. A driver error or brake problem approaching the pivot at speed could have been much worse than the sweeper (think smashing into the parked cars). That being said, only so much can be done on that sort of course. Old timers will remember the Belk warehouse in Morrisville, where we were truly lucky to have as little carnage as we did over several years. I recall two cars burrowing under the chain link fencing and one bent fire hydrant, on a site less than half the size of Cary, while passing within ten feet of parked semi-trailers

.

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 4:49 pm

Neal Harrington wrote:

Old timers will remember the Belk warehouse in Morrisville, where we were truly lucky to have as little carnage as we did over several years. I recall two cars burrowing under the chain link fencing and one bent fire hydrant, on a site less than half the size of Cary, while passing within ten feet of parked semi-trailers

.

I went to that site just once, and that indeed was when John Kerfoot went under the chain-link fence. The lot was the size of a McDonald's without the building, and no fun at all IMO.

Steven Spampinato · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 5:21 pm

AHHH blast from the past. John Keerfoot throwing his formula V under the fence. Poor guy, felt bad for him. He spent a year putting that V together. Broke it first outing. Who had the GTI that did it?

Vincent Keene wrote:

Neal Harrington wrote:

Old timers will remember the Belk warehouse in Morrisville, where we were truly lucky to have as little carnage as we did over several years. I recall two cars burrowing under the chain link fencing and one bent fire hydrant, on a site less than half the size of Cary, while passing within ten feet of parked semi-trailers

.

I went to that site just once, and that indeed was when John Kerfoot went under the chain-link fence. The lot was the size of a McDonald's without the building, and no fun at all IMO.

Steven Spampinato · **Posted:** Tue Sep 20, 2016 5:25 pm

The old Kerfoot V. I miss John, he was a nice guy.

Neal Harrington · **Joined:** Thu Sep 04, 2003 4:29 pm **Posts:** 106

John Messenheimer Jr. was the other victim. His VW allegedly had an ABS malfunction due to metallic brake dust buildup. The amazing thing was how the chain-link fence rode up over the car, and suffered almost no damage. The car, however, had front suspension damage from the curb that it leaped about six feet before the fence.

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