THSCC Forums

So I was reading the latest Car And Driver and in "Charting the Changes" noticed something really interesting on page 100...

"The MR2 Spyder gets an optional limited-slip differential."

Having autocrossed a stock 2002 with an open diff a few times, i can say the car is freaking incredible as-is, but could really be helped by an LSD. So what do you guys think - new overdog in C Stock?

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)

I thought that until last week. Ask any of the Spyder drivers in P7-9 why they could NOT ever have a chance to win. The first answer probably is a person (Telehowski) and the 2nd answer would be the copious amount of wheelspin they suffered through out the weekend.

The LSD will put it at the same level as the Miata, it will probably give the MR2 a small edge at the Pro Solo's.

We should see a bit locally, I know that the Peterson's, and Donnie Barnes are all already on a waiting list for the first ones here.

Scott

A few thoughts on the topic...unencumbered by the thought process ....

This will be frequently debated between now and nationals next year. The slip will clearly help, but there is no way to tell until we see how the car is set up. Finding the right shock valving/sway bar/tire combo for the car will be the key. The new Hoosiers will be different and we will likely not be able to run 225s up front and on the rear again. So, I've already been thinking about how best to setup the car for next year. The 2004 Spyder is a bit heavier than my car and will have a less favorable tire setup, but the LSD should address the biggest problem we have, corner exit push/wheelspin.

Currently, IMO, at Topeka, the Miata is still a slightly better car for that site surface, but the current Spyder is capable of winning. Had Tim been in my car last week, we could have seen a different outcome. I missed the setup on our Spyder which really hurt on Day #1, but I still felt like it was good enough for 2nd. FWIW, I beat the 2nd place driver in CS this year at the Nationals warm-up event in Topeka in August by about 1 second per day (Donnie beat him as well) and the 6th place driver by 1 second total. So, the car wasn't the primarily problem there, those guys just outdrove us at Nationals.

Telehowski will still be tough to beat next year at Topeka since he's an excellent driver and that particular car is setup to perfection. We've run close to Steve a few times this year and missed a few chances to win due to coneage, so we have some hope for next year. If Donnie, Chris, and I can nail the setup and improve our driving skills it will be fun to see what we can do with the Spyder next year. There is no question that the Miata is an easier car to drive at 10/10ths than the Spyder, so it takes a while to learn to drive the Spyder well as you can't flog it and get away with like you can in a Miata. Being a flogger/hackmaster myself, this has been a tough challenge to adjust to in the car. Ultimately, I love the Spyder and think that it's potential has not yet been tapped. Other than Tim Aro, no other A+ driver has driven the car competitively.

BTW, mine will be for sale after Laurinburg...the new one arrives in January. Karl, interested in buying an extra set of stock wheels for your Mom's Spyder

Eric

Eric, I'm curious...why is this? Are they going to be even wider than the already-awfully-wide 225 Hoosiers and not fit?

I'll think about the wheels, if I can dig up the money I'm interested.

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)

2003+ MR2's got new wheel sizes, 16x7 out back , and 15x? up front. The problem is, you can't get a good back tire for a 16" wheel, just one option and that is 215/40-16. Couple that to a fatter front tire and there might be a little bit of oversteer.

Scott,
The new tires are supposed to have an ungodly stiff sidewall, and those that were able to shoe horn the A3S03's in a 225/45/15 previously, will not be able to with the A3S04. I'm not sure this will be true with a 15x6.5" wheel, but the 15x6 wheels ('00-04' MR2's) might have an issue. If this is the case, Carpenter's 225's on his 5" wheel will not be possible anymore on the CRX. Too bad - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Hoosier Tom had a set of 205 50? 15 A3SO4's at Topeka. We put a 225 45 15 A3SO3 tread to tread with it and the 205's were < 1/4" narrower across the tread! We may have to widen our trailer for the 225's!!!!

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SPIN or WIN!
there's no glory for going slow.

The combination of the extra stiff sidewall on the new tires will make it harder to get the tire on the front rims. In addition, the bulge on the side of the new tire (they call it a rim protector) will make the tire too wide to clear my springs and sway bar. Currently the 225s rub these parts as it is.

Actually, I'd love to run 225s up front and the 215/4016s in the rear, the oversteer would be quite controllable with bar and shocks. As it is now, the car fights a horrible push on low grip surfaces and we have to do crazy stuff to make it work (sort of) locally.

I'm hoping the additional 1/2 inch of rim width and a little extra length from the 16 inch rim will provide enough extra contact patch to make up for using a smaller tire on the rear.

Makes sense now, thanks. Ya know, I *almost* typed something like "try a different offset wheel and get one 7 inches wide" and remembered, just in time, that you guys can't do that Seriously, I assume you've tried wheel spacers and whatever little bit of slack they give you on wheel offset too?

Hrm. As usual my proposed choice of Karl's next car purchase isn't as much of a nobrainer as I thought it was.

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)

Karl, if you were looking to buy a 2004 Spyder I think it would be hard to go wrong with the choice. While it may not be a "no brainer" as to which car will be the best next year 1999 Sport Miata or a 2004 Spyder, I think the Spyder is going to be *very* competitive...otherwise I wouldn't be buying one. The Miatas will likely struggle with the smaller tire issue as well as the Spyders since we both have 15 x 6 inch front rims. The Spyder is very competitive now nationally, the slip can only help. Locally, the best driver usually wins as long as cars are reasonably close. The new Spyder probably be easier to setup since shocks are now available and you likely won't need a monster front bar to make it work well.

It will definitely be fun to see how the cars stack up.

Eric

Does Scott's comment about no good back tire for a 16" wheel, mean in general or is specific to the MR2's 16x7 wheel?

Rick... He was speaking specifically for the 16x7 Spyder wheels. Hoosier doesn't make a 225/40/16, but they do make a 215/40/16 which isn't quite as good as the previous 225's you could mount on the 15" rims. - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S