2-day points event with different courses

Ryan Holton · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 9:52 am

JamesShort wrote:

Steve, I mentioned making it 2 independent points events with the caveat that you'd have to drop 3 events lowest instead of 2 and Les seemed to think I was nuts, so I'm not sure. Anyone else like that idea?

Yes, better than a bunch of math

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

Agreed, I like that one better.

Jeremy Ellison · **Joined:** Fri May 13, 2011 5:01 pm **Posts:** 186

I think making it 2 events and allowing people to drop an extra one makes a lot of sense.

That or score the events separately and then count the best finish for each person?

Keith Quistorff · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:53 am

Hate to be the fly in the ointment (or maybe I'm not understanding the proposed method for calculation), but using raw times to calculate a single time delta for all car classes has one inherent / major flaw - it doesn't account for the performance difference between car classes. For instance, if Dick Rasmussen (in his DM car) and Gwen Bakke (in her HS car) each show up one of the two days, their times will be compared by adding/subracting the same time delta (14 seconds, in the example given by James earlier), while the actual time difference attributed to the longer vs. shorter course would be very different in the DM car vs. the HS car.

I thought of a simpler approach that I believe addresses this issue, as well as any other potential issues. I'll bounce it off James by PM first for sanity check, then propose it publicly if he agrees.

Les Davis · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 2:04 pm **Posts:** 2059

JohnByers wrote:

IMHO this is making something more difficult and confusing than needs be. Use the past as a guideline for points and let the rest be gravy. I know I enjoyed driving my RX8 on Saturday and Frank on Sunday last year. Smarter not harder, repeat over and over again!

And yes, thanks to those who do the grunt work :thumbsup:

John, how could you possibly have had fun last year, it was the same course both days, weren't you bored senseless? ;-)

JamesShort · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:01 am

Keith Quistorff wrote:

Hate to be the fly in the ointment (or maybe I'm not understanding the proposed method for calculation), but using raw times to calculate a single time delta for all car classes has one inherent / major flaw - it doesn't account for the performance difference between car classes. For instance, if Dick Rasmussen (in his DM car) and Gwen Bakke (in her HS car) each show up one of the two days, their times will be compared by adding/subracting the same time delta (14 seconds, in the example given by James earlier), while the actual time difference attributed to the longer vs. shorter course would be very different in the DM car vs. the HS car.

I thought of a simpler approach that I believe addresses this issue, as well as any other potential issues. I'll bounce it off James by PM first for sanity check, then propose it publicly if he agrees.

Yup, I agree. There really is no ideal. And we can't do it class by class since a lot of classes are sparse and statistically irrelevant.

I think I'm leaning 2 separate points events and the best counts.

Les Davis · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 2:04 pm **Posts:** 2059

JamesShort wrote:

Steve, I mentioned making it 2 independent points events with the caveat that you'd have to drop 3 events lowest instead of 2 and Les seemed to think I was nuts, so I'm not sure. Anyone else like that idea?

While you are clearly nutz James, that has little to do with this discussion. I like Steven's suggestion, both Brice and Keith have pointed out major valid problems with the time delta approach.

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

I just want to know where the pool party is going to be held.

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

Arthur McDonald wrote:

I just want to know where the pool party is going to be held.

Whoops. Missed Matt's event posting: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=12882

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:49 pm

JamesShort wrote:

I think I'm leaning 2 separate points events and the best counts.

Ditto. So from a timing & scoring perspective, is it possible to just do 9 points events and drop three? This sounds like the ultimate (& only) compromise in order to make this jive.

We can just do the Jimmy V activities on Sunday.

Using the delta & standard deviation sound good in theory but I don't want anyone to be stressing & sweating out the math at the end of the event in the bus while everyone's waiting to do trophies. Nevermind the difficulty of explaining it to everyone in the drivers' meeting. :lol:

The more I think about it, it's sounding like a pretty good idea to just make both count for points and it's still a little bit of an advantage (why not, right?) to do both days for those that are making it a full auto-x weekend.

Steven Carter · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:00 pm

If both days are counted as separate points autocross, then my season pass is good for both days, right? Right???? :poke:

{ducks}

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:05 pm

We can just have a poll for which day we want season passes to count if we go that route. Oh wait, nevermind. :lol:

RodneyWright · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:05 pm

Matt McGrain wrote:

The more I think about it, it's sounding like a pretty good idea to just make both count for points and it's still a little bit of an advantage (why not, right?) to do both days for those that are making it a full auto-x weekend.

I second this motion. I for one like the points counting for both days and running the same course. While some might find it boring on the second day, I find it a challange to find just that little 1/10th of a second and push the car harder. The upside to this is folks can drive either day and get points along w/ no additional setup needed for the second day.

Just my 2cents worth of input, but I know James like to hurt himself mathwise and keep the grey matter active

I've decided to drown mine in beer :mrgreen:

RodneyWright · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:08 pm

So question in regard to overnight storage of trailers? Is this something we can do? This seems like a very open site and possibly easy access for night crawlers. Has anyone asked if we can park trailers overnight or do we need to remove?

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

I haven't asked explicitly if this is ok, but technically we have the site rented from 3 pm Friday through Sunday when we pack up and leave. It IS an open site, but it is also a lot that is basically shared with the State Highway Patrol.

THSCC Forums

2-day points event with different courses

Who is online