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That was fun. Thanks Liz, Ray, James and Les for all the setup work, Brice and Mary for getting the bus there and back, and the insane number of drivers for showing up to play. That was a long autox weekend, but well worth it. Some of us were out there a total of about 17 hours over the course of two days.

BTW, we knew the launch interval was going to be 40sec going into this, but were expecting about 110 people, which would've been a little less time-consuming. I didn't have anything better to do all day yesterday, though.

Yes, we are in an interesting position regarding: potentially reinstating entry caps, overlaps going forward, pricing structure etc.

Just some random thoughts:

1. 160 people is VERY doable assuming a course that have 20s or less launch intervals with the ability to safely have 3 cars on course at the same time (ie one car almost finish, one car half way through and 1 car just off launch)

1a. 160 people including 40+ non member on site registrations (which is now $5 more) == $$$

1b. High entries might mean more $$ but it also adds complexity to infrastructure and given we never know how many walk-ups we will have, it's hard to prepare for days like yesterday. So it might be the prudent thing to possibly add back a 120 entry cap (granted yesterday could have just been a fluke) and always assume the worst and really focus on a safe 20-30s launch interval. Then the day of, after every one is there (all VPs, Pres, other support folks) and we see the course etc, we can possibly make a definitive decision to let up to a max of 130 or 140, or say, nope, we are sticking steadfast to 120 and the walk ups can go home.

2. A 40s launch interval is not bad for ~100 people with a relatively small percentage of novices. A 40s launch interval with 160 drivers with 36 Novices is an equation for a LONG day.

2a. There is nothing wrong with Novices...As Rodney said, Novices are what the hardcore folks used to be and the few that become hooked and become long term drivers are what persists this club. Hell I was a NOV at the end of 2009.

3. The course was not complicated at all so there were not many DNFs or spins or offs so that helped given the conditions.

4. Sanford costs us $$$ and lots of people come to Sanford due to its proximity and it's long courses.

4a. I understand some people's thoughts on the use of the taxiway in terms of safety etc. However, the taxiway doesn't HAVE to be 60+ mph transitions, it can be 45mph transitions with a drag finish....hint hint.

5. Ms. Cordova did a great job on chairing .

6. We need to come up with a grid policy. It was chaos. Get back in the same order as you started. Don't harass the grid worker with questions about 'when is this run group going to be over', 'when do I work', blah blah blah

7. Music playing on the speakers around the bus/grid and the pits is great (and you still get to hear Bernie's vette over it as well ).

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2011/2012 Autox VP
2013/2014.5 President
2013 Top Gun

2015 Fit

22R-EC => 4G63 => D16Y7 + D16Y8 => EJ255 + K24Z2 => K20Z3 + K24Z2 => K24Z2 + M54 => L15B

I enjoyed the heck out of the day, and although I didn't like the course when I walked it, I liked it a lot when I drove it.

For those complaining of a long day at autocross, remember how much LONGER those who helped make it happen worked. It truly was a freak occurence to have that many walkups that made it last so long. I like the idea of entry caps a lot more than restricting course design. The interval would have been ok with a reasonable cap, and our sites are already restrictive enough in terms of course design. This was something different for Sanford, I liked it a lot. We obviously can't have 60 sec launch intervals, but 40 would have been ok if not for the massive turnout.

I was a bit surprised at the number of DNF's and cones given the course (I didn't hit any all day, at least I thought. . . see below), at least during the time I was in the bus.

On a personal note, I like race tires. They are awesome. The only thing that kept it from being a perfect day for me was the mysterious +2 on my fastest run of the day. Did anybody happen to catch which ones I hit? Not that it would make a huge difference, I just swear I didn't hit anything on that run, I can't find any marks, and my wife didn't see any when she watched the run.

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2012 MX-5 Sport SUV

A little less than 20% of the overall runs were DNFs, just FYI.

I think yesterday taught us that we should never ever have a course with a 40 sec overlap. Never, until the end of time.



I really hated the music. Just noise to add to the noise. If I want to hear music, I'll put on my headphones. It was really irritating having to hear that in the pits.

Thanks to everyone for a great day. It was long but still fun.

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"Never let life be shaped by fear of its end"

No, you're a towel!

I had a great time as well and enjoyed the somewhat simple, yet challenging course. Of course longer courses are indeed "more fun" from a driving perspective (more seat time = good), but I think the huge novice turnout was GREAT, especially for the season-opener event. Hopefully a bunch of them will continue to come back throughout the season.

Big thanks to everyone who made the event happen and busted their butts over such long days, and I'm glad we were able to handle the overwhelming number of walkups.

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2015-2017 President
2014 Track VP
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We need to get the cap back in place. I'm not terribly interested in spending over 12 hours driving to/from/at autocross. I can only socialize so much in one day. I don't think 20s overlap is realistic, from events I've run start at we've generally hovered around 30s. I appreciate all the time everyone puts in on these long days but I don't think we should be demanding it from our officers/ECs or asking it from the membership.

I still think the best autocross I've ever done was the last one at Sanford last year. ~80 people 5 competition runs, 2 or 3 fun runs and we were on the way home around 3-4pm. A lot of this had to do with it was a down the taxiway up the runway Sanford course with no forced overlap other than time to shag cones/safety factor.

I agree with Marcus on the music, you're never going to make everyone happy with what you play.

I worked grid in the 4th heat. It was not bad. Very few people, if any harassed me. I had issues with people claiming to not know they had to be told when to go, but when I explained it, they were fine gave me no grief over it.

I also had an issue with two DSP1's which the bus seemed to catch about the same time I did.

I do however know that some people were given a substantial amount of grief while working grid. I guess by the time the 4th group got here, everyone just simply knew it was going to be a long day and was pointless to complain to me.

Yeah, I didn't like the music either. It wasn't bad music, and it wasn't that it was present, it was just too damn loud. I don't like having to yell at people all day to be heard, or having to say "what?" so much. Turn the volume down a little next time.

As for grid, no big deal this time, just don't be shy about yelling at the next 10 people to get in their car NOW, because you know they're going to procrastinate. And don't be shy about skipping over people who aren't in their cars ready to go. Just tell them to pull up to the line whenever they're ready. Just do what you can to keep 3-5 cars at the line at all times. No more, no less.

I'm going to save the 40-sec launch intervals for non-pts, non-novice, entry capped at 80 events from now on. I could've easily cut about 5-10 sec off yesterday's launch interval once we knew how many people had shown up, but it would've screwed people who walked the course early, and I wasn't really that motivated to do so.

I remember leaving Sanford in the dark before, though. I remember Art McDonald had to jump start the bus with his Mustang in the dark, because nobody started it all day and the batteries got drained. I think I was the one driving it home. Fun times.

From my perspective, we shouldn't ever have an entry cap. It's probably the reason why our events haven't been as popular as 5+ years ago, for people don't feel like they can make the drive and run. We should be planning on a large group of walk-ups and if it doesn't happen, you end up with 5 runs or a shorter day.

Even with 80 people a 40 second launch interval is not a good idea. If you have any timing issues at all or a long delay with a broken car on course and it makes for a brutally long day. EVERY course should be designed with no more than 20-25 second launch interval. If we don't want to limit our course designs, then maybe we should pull out that $2k paperweight of a wireless timing system and get it up and running.

Yesterday's course rewarded patience which I didn't have on about 3.5 hours of sleep, but it flowed fine.

From a music in the pits perspective, like Marcus, I wasn't a fan. I was constantly trying to figure out who was blasting music from their car.

We do need to do something about the positioning of the display or get people to write times on sticky notes, as seeing the board prior to the next car was a chore at best. I would think with 160 people, we had plenty of workers to make this a position.

The grid was a mess and disorganized at best, at least for the first heat. Sanford is one of those places where it might be best to hold grid in the front of the paddock and pull people up the taxiway to run. It's not an easy thing to solve though with the layout of the pavement.

All in all, it was still a good event. - AB

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I do know exactly (maybe with a few small changes) what the course design for the next autox I chair at Sanford will be, btw. And it's going to be AWESOME (Les will love it). And the launch interval will be exactly 25 sec for the fastest people.

I agree, walkups will go down if we cap the events. No one is going to drive. any distance at all with the possibility of being turned away...As Aaron said plan for the crowd and if it doesn't happen add runs. Everyone wins in either case.

It's also an imperative to have times at hand for drivers, the displayed times were way too far away for anyone that mattered to see. I personally don't care if spectators can see the times they don't matter, only the driver and T&S matter. Two people should be assigned to this task, a radio talker at T&S who tells the worker at finish what the times are.

The music was a distraction, but you'll never please everyone no matter what you do. Some want loud , some soft, some want oldies etc,ect.

The grid was a mess is an under statement. We really need to set up a grid plan then stick to it. Parking spectator cars in the grass beside the grid area only adds to the confusion.

Just MHO.
I did enjoy the course even if I didn't drive it that well.

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Yes! I forgot to mention this, but it made things a mess. It wasn't just spectator cars either, it was driver's cars from the later heats. Made getting the cars that were running organized in the grid even worse.

Re Music: I didn't care about what was playing or loudness. I just liked some white noise in the pits as I was setting the car up. I guess I'm in the few.

And yes, workers with stickies at courses like that from now on.

_________________
2011/2012 Autox VP
2013/2014.5 President
2013 Top Gun

2015 Fit

22R-EC => 4G63 => D16Y7 + D16Y8 => EJ255 + K24Z2 => K20Z3 + K24Z2 => K24Z2 + M54 => L15B

+1


We had the sticky notes working during the second heat and onward (though later it was just a verbal report on your time). It just took us a while to realize that drivers couldn't see their times (yes, I'm gonna say it and then duck... please complain more promptly in the future ).


I take a lot of the blame for this, since Steve and I failed to communicate clearly how the run groups were going to work. Given four run groups of all-at-once runs, nobody has to work and run back-to-back, so we can decide in advance next time what the B line ought to be used for -- two-driver cars, splitting up the single-driver cars, whatever. I think this caused a lot of confusion and moving cars around in the grid, especially in the first heat. Then each subsequent grid worker had to make a call about what he thought the second line was for, and I don't think it was ever crystal-clear to anybody.

On a totally unrelated side-note, Mike Miller should be glad he only got beat by ONE of his sons... my dad got thrashed by BOTH his daughters.

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"Nationals snob"

Once you reach x number of drivers it is also possible to go to a 5th heat. Number of drivers/runs remains the same, but the work assignments are shorter. This will be a must, especially during the summer months. No one should be out there 2 1/2 + hours shagging cones-or doing timing and scoring, for that matter. Split run groups are just out of the question IMO when we reach yesterday's numbers.

The first event of the season is always the shake down event, so, all in all, I'd say we learned a lot yesterday. (I guess my worries about taking some of these things to the staff forum were unfounded, since they have been addressed here.)

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