THSCC Forums

I need help deciding on what kind of video camera to buy for recording rally cross runs and forthcoming new baby. Ops - "Yes honey - I mean baby first and rallyx second..." From what I know so far, hard drive (expensive) offers the convenience of vast amounts of storage but would you strap your laptop to a paint mixer and expect it to last? I'm told the DVD type will probably skip and the disks don't hold all that much video. Finally MiniDV tapes, least expensive, the professional's choice for highest quality recording, will work but how long will this format be around? Any suggestions?

Mini DV tapes have worked well for me, although I have only strapped it in the car a few times. If I were to buy another one right now it would be a hard drive one.

Congrats on the baby!

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~ RallyX VP 2009 ~
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'92 Prelude
'76 Celica

I think MiniDV is the best format for car stuff. Tape transports are very reliable and rugged. A DVD burner would definitely not work for in-car footage, and although a hard drive might, I've got to think the vibration will shorten its lifetime. And what happens if the HD fails? You're done for the day, you've got an expensive repair on your hands, and a tricky data recovery option (if you think it's even worth it to try).

Another thing about hard drive recorders, is whatever storage space you've got, that's it. If you fill up the drive, you've got to get your footage off before you can shoot more. That process may or may not be quick and easy (I don't know), but you need to be prepared for it. With MiniDV, just pop in another $3 tape and deal with it later.

Again, just MHO.

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Carl Fisher

Be Cool to the Pizza Dude:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... Id=4651531

The only thing I'd consider besides tape at this point would be a solid state device. Issue is that you're limited on storage and to be honest the quality isn't quite there yet unless you were only using it for in-car.

I looked into HDD based cameras and they've all had issues with different editing applications as far as retrieving the data off the internal drive and working with it. Usually involves using a brand specific piece of software (Canon, JVC, Sony, etc). I like what I use and don't see the need to change that just to get a disk drive in a camera.

All of this is what's kept me on tape. As far as how long tape's around, I don't think that's a significant worry for a long, long time. And besides, as long as you can get a camera that works, a cable and a computer you can always retrieve it.

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Not spectacular just decent.
I'm not sure what I'm driving.
Maybe an ITR in DS.
Or half-assed STX prepped 330.

Actually, let me amend that last opinion. If you were planning on capturing your in-car footage using an external bullet-type cam like this, then I think a hard drive recorder would be fine if you kept it in a case like this, which you could secure somewhere in the car and operate via LANC remote like this.

It makes your outlay a bit more, but it also adds flexibility in mounting, extends the life of your camcorder, and the LANC remotes are much easier to use in-car than messing with a camera.

Just make sure that the camcorder you buy can accept external AV inputs (many can't) and LANC remote.

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Carl Fisher

Be Cool to the Pizza Dude:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... Id=4651531

MiniDV seems to be the prevalent standard for consumer user, both DVD and HDD cameras have some flaws when it comes to the vibrations of the car. I seriously doubt MiniDV is going anywhere, heck for some of our professional field cameras we still use Beta tapes, however our newest HD camera we have uses Blue-Ray.

That being said I just picked up for home use a Canon HV10 it shoots in 1080i HD and records to regular MiniDV tapes, haven't tried it out in the car yet as the "main" reason we got it was for our new baby.

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83 Porsche 911SC
07 Ford F150

I bought a Canon HV20 about a month ago to replace our old 8mm camcorder. It does HD 1080i on MiniDV and I am curous to see how well it works in the car as well.

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Richard Casto
1972 Porsche 914
2013 Honda Fit Sport
2015 Honda Fit EX
http://motorsport.zyyz.com
Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.

Big fan of my HV20. It's taken a pretty sincere amount of abuse in a short period of time and keeps taking great tape.

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Not spectacular just decent.
I'm not sure what I'm driving.
Maybe an ITR in DS.
Or half-assed STX prepped 330.

My big reason for preferring solid state recorders for racing is just the simple fact that I'm going to transfer EVERYTHING I record to computer, and it transfers a LOT faster than a tape would.

But in a world where you want one device to record racing and baby, well, there's pretty much no question...MiniDV. Hard drive and DVD burner devices will not work in the car. They have been known to work *okay* in a box that dampens vibes, but it's still somewhat hard on them to do that and will shorten their lives, I think.

These days I'd go with something that can do HD to MiniDV.


--Donnie

Thanks for the input, sounds like MiniDV is the way to go. Back when ESPN2 and SPEED Channel were showing SCCA ProRally, all their in car equipment was miniDV.

Q on editing, I'm assuming I can copy all this wonderful baby-in-rallyx footage to my computer's hard drive then edit it with the proper software (such as MS Movie Maker)?

I am still pretty new to the digital editing aspect of it myself (just bought Ulead Video Studio 11+), but I would assume pretty much any MiniDV camcorder you get is going to have IEEE 1394 output. Via this, you should be able to transfer the digital video directly to your PC and then once there edit it. Your editing software (don't know much about MS Movie Maker) may even handle the transfer/capture operation.

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Richard Casto
1972 Porsche 914
2013 Honda Fit Sport
2015 Honda Fit EX
http://motorsport.zyyz.com
Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.

Yep, MS Moviemaker will let you transfer directly from most MiniDV cameras over firewire, and has most of the basic editing functions you might need.
It'll only get you video files for output, though. You'll have to get other software if you want to generate DVD's and the like.

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One of those LeMonHeads...
91/95 Miata, 02 Focus SVT, 01 Ford F250, 09 Suzuki SV650SF
rusty 84 C4 Vette, tiny piece of the General Lei
Irish Sport Horse - 1hp NA!

Your PC will also need a Firewire card- most new PCs have one, but you should check. The connectors look sort of like USB sockets, but about twice as wide, and with a bevel or taper at the top. They look like this:

Just on a personal note, even though it doesn't look like it should be possible to insert a Firewire plug in upside-down, you actually can, and if you do you will burn out the card on your PC and the circuit in your camera too. So make sure you know the orientation of the socket before groping around under the desk with your plug!

For discussion of video editing software, see this thread.

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Carl Fisher

Be Cool to the Pizza Dude:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... Id=4651531

For you guys with the HDV cameras. Here a free and easy piece of software to get your miniDV tapes your local hard drive (as Premier kept crashing/dropping frames). It will even detect time-code breaks and split it into separate files(M2T). Then you can edit with your choice of editors.

http://strony.aster.pl/paviko/hdvsplit.htm

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83 Porsche 911SC
07 Ford F150

How much quality do you really need....really?

If you don't need HD quality you might look at what I do. I use a point and shoot camera that also records video onto SD cards. Works just fine. Plus I have the utility of the still camera all in a very tidy package. There are two that I use:
Canon SD 600 and a Canon S2 IS. I can chop the video in Quicktime Pro without having to recode them.

They won't hold a candle to a nice video camera as far as ultimate quality, but more often I prefer the ease of file handling and compact size. I can put the little sd600 in my pocket and the S2 is fist sized so its easy to toss in a bag or glovebox.

You can find deals on either the SD or IS cameras as the new models appear.

The newest is the Canon S5 IS, but you might find a closeout deal on the S3 (S4 was skipped):
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/specs/C ... n_s3is.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canons5is/
If you can live with a lower resolution (320 rather than the 640 setting), it will work just fine.

Another thing, most folks look too hard at the maximum telephoto length when they would really be served better by a wider angle lens at the other end of the zoom...especially in a car. That stands for any camera you buy.

I generally prefer the S2 in the car for its wider angle which allows me to see A-pillar to A-pillar and that it takes AA batteries.