Nitrous Tires

RobLupella · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:45 pm

Way back when we figured out that the reason Patrice was so fast was because he put either Canadian Air in his tires or he had a hidden nitrous system :lol:

Went to the dealer today to get warranty work and they are now pushing Nitrogen fill for your tires, lifetime of the tires for $40. Claim is that they will not lose pressure, they wear longer etc, etc, etc.

I'm not planning on doing it to 45K tires, the lifespan will not be worth it, but I have my doubts on the real merits. Any ideas if as I suspect this is a marketing tool or is there merit.

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 2:10 pm

RobLupella wrote:

Claim is that they will not lose pressure, they wear longer etc, etc, etc.

I'm not a chemist, but is there any gas that isn't affected by temperature? If there isn't the "never lose pressure" part is bogus. How it would affect wear...uh...now that's something I'd like to see proven. :roll:

It's a good racket though. Get a cylinder, label it "Nitrogen" fill it with "Air" (for free), and charge $40 for it. How would the customer tell the difference?

Richard Casto · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 2:15 pm

RobLupella wrote:

Blah, blah blah...$40.

How much do the left handed muffler bushing cost?

Vincent Keene · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 2:19 pm

Richard Casto wrote:

RobLupella wrote:

Blah, blah blah...$40.

How much do the left handed muffler bushing cost?

Slightly more than the titanium moly coated washer fluid bearings. :wink:

Matt Nicholson · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 3:24 pm

Considering regular ol' plain air is 80% nitrogen, I fail to see exactly how much better 100% nitrogen could be.

Now, if they put HELIUM in there to make the tires lighter, that might be worth something

Frank Catena · **Joined:** Wed Aug 27, 2003 1:08 pm **Posts:** 418

Its all about the easy availability of dry nitrogen gas (and profits) ... at least for street applications.

RobLupella · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 5:41 pm

If they would guarantee my tires would last 100K that would be one thing. They "Claim" that it reduces moisture in the tires which wears them out quickly.

Probably rusts the steel belts :roll:

Patrice Bousquet · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 5:56 pm

Here what i find under goggle.

Nitrogen In Tires

Here are a few other benefits of using Nitrogen in tires:

[1] Nitrogen is denser than Oxygen: This means the larger molecules escape less easily from tires resulting in a more gradual loss of pressure over time. According to the Michelin Tire Manual, a tire that is inflated with Nitrogen loses its pressure 3 times slower than if it were inflated with air.

[2] Nitrogen is moisture free: Pure Nitrogen inflated tires experience less steel belt and rubber degradation. Nitrogen use also reduces valve and wheel corrosion.

[3] Nitrogen provides longer tire life: Nitrogen inflated tire run cooler and require less maintenance according to the Goodyear application bulletin.

[4] Nitrogen is non-flammable: Nitrogen technology has been used in aircraft, military and race car technology for over thirty years.

Patrice

Richard Casto · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 6:15 pm

Patrice Bousquet wrote:

Here what i find under goggle.

Nitrogen In Tires

Here are a few other benefits of using Nitrogen in tires:

[1] Nitrogen is denser than Oxygen: This means the larger molecules escape less easily from tires resulting in a more gradual loss of pressure over time. According to the Michelin Tire Manual, a tire that is inflated with Nitrogen loses its pressure 3 times slower than if it were inflated with air.

[2] Nitrogen is moisture free: Pure Nitrogen inflated tires experience less steel belt and rubber degradation. Nitrogen use also reduces valve and wheel corrosion.

[3] Nitrogen provides longer tire life: Nitrogen inflated tire run cooler and require less maintenance according to the Goodyear application bulletin.

[4] Nitrogen is non-flammable: Nitrogen technology has been used in aircraft, military and race car technology for over thirty years.

Patrice

Patrice, not attacking the messenger on this one. Just the message.

#1 Probably true. Worth the trouble?

#2 Sure Nitrogen is moisture free. So is dry air.

#3 Color me confused. Is this just the moisture issue all over again?

#4 Should I be concerned about the air in my tires causing a fire?

The bottom line is that this is probably 99% a case of less moisture is better. And that a bottle of nitrogen is a cheap way to provide "moisture free air". If I had nothing better to do, I might put nitrogen in my tires, but it would be pretty low on my list.

ChuckNelson · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 6:54 pm

I run hydrogen in my tires 'cause it makes the car lighter.

Wes Eargle · **Joined:** Mon Oct 27, 2003 9:47 am **Posts:** 3683

Pure nitrogen also doesn't have oxygen in it that reacts with the rubber. The downside of this is that the air on the *outside* of the tire also is in contact with oxygen. Also, most rimZ out there don't have dual inlets (like the Koseis do) so you couldn't apply a vacuum to the seated tire and then add an inert gas.

But as far as marketing goes, it's souper geeeenius.

Todd Breakey · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 9:03 pm

At the rate that most of us go through tires, is internal degradation really an issue??

The only aircraft that run nitrogen in their tires are jets and high altitude turbo props. And the only reason is moisture that is present in compressed air. If that moisture were to freeze at the extreme temps at altitude, there could be problems with out of balance tires upon landing.

RobLupella · **Posted:** Thu Nov 02, 2006 9:51 pm

Patrice Bousquet wrote:

Here what i find under goggle.

Nitrogen In Tires

Here are a few other benefits of using Nitrogen in tires:

[1] Nitrogen is denser than Oxygen: This means the larger molecules escape less easily from tires resulting in a more gradual loss of pressure over time. According to the Michelin Tire Manual, a tire that is inflated with Nitrogen loses its pressure 3 times slower than if it were inflated with air.

[2] Nitrogen is moisture free: Pure Nitrogen inflated tires experience less steel belt and rubber degradation. Nitrogen use also reduces valve and wheel corrosion.

[3] Nitrogen provides longer tire life: Nitrogen inflated tire run cooler and require less maintenance according to the Goodyear application bulletin.

[4] Nitrogen is non-flammable: Nitrogen technology has been used in aircraft, military and race car technology for over thirty years.

Patrice

Those are pretty much the arguements they used.

1. I have a pressure guage and a compressor, so I can add air easily
2. I put over 25K p/year on the car, I don't think rust is an issue
3. They would have to guarantee a mileage increase
4. I won't smoke near my tires :wink:

They show the space shuttle and NASCRAP cars on their brochure.

Thanks for the research.

MikeWhitney · **Joined:** Wed Aug 20, 2003 9:15 pm **Posts:** 4724

Todd Breakey wrote:

At the rate that most of us go through tires, is internal degradation really an issue??

The only aircraft that run nitrogen in their tires are jets and high altitude turbo props. And the only reason is moisture that is present in compressed air. If that moisture were to freeze at the extreme temps at altitude, there could be problems with out of balance tires upon landing.

Thank god someone brings some tech to this thread!

Me? I'm gonna run coffee in my tires next year. I hear the caffeine makes the rubber stickier, and I can have a hot cup o' joe in grid after my runs.

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