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Yeah, I second that. How the heck did you get -3 degrees out of the front?!? Anyone else acheive that?

Come on guys, this is Aaron. You know he got drunk and just woke up with -3 degrees of camber in the car!

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In need of car.

Camber Creeper?

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Has no responsibility whatsoever.

While ride height is important its not the measurement you want to make. What you want to do, as Diane said, is get the cross weights (front left plus right rear to equal front right plus left rear) to be as close to the same as possible WITH THE DRIVER IN THE CAR!!

You can use real scales like Mark Vitacco has and will rent time to you on or you can do the cheap man's version which is, no surprise, what I do. I use 4 standard cheap bathroom scales and levers to split the weight at the scale. If you want more detail let me know off line and I'll go into how to do this. Results? Using this method in my garage I got my Miata's (now Diane's) cross weights to within 50 lb of each other (as measured later on Roebling Road's scales). Not too bad for abut $40 and an hour or so of time.

Setting your car up compared, in this case, to Bowie's is an OK place to start but not necessarily the place to end.

Good luck!

Ron

How much did you lower yours? - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

12 3/8" in front

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Has no responsibility whatsoever.

Sure Ron, and I have corner weighted my car (although I am skeptical of the "holy grail" of corner weighting) but you have to have reasonable ride height starting points. I mean the coil over has a range adjustment of several inches. You don't just wanna slap them on there hap hazzardly, with 14 inch ride height on one corner and 11 on another. Corner weighting is a fine tuning adjustment made after ride height is set. After I set my ride height, when I then corner weighted, I doubt I moved any single corner more than an 1/8 of an inch, if that.

As much of a pain as it is to coner weight the car, you don't want to have to make to many adjustments. After precisely setting my ride heights, my corner weights were pretty close the first time rolling on the scale, only need a couple slight adjustments to nail the corner weight.

I think this a nearly a 2" drop from stock.

You guys have me really curious. I'm taking the car to annual tech on Saturday. I'll see if we wrote down where we set it, and if not, I'll measure it if it comes off the trailer.

Diane

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Diane (Hall) Bundas
1992 Spec Miata #48 - 1997 Chevy Tahoe - 2007 Honda Civic Coupe

I was going to ask someone who had corner weighted their car about this exact thing (how much did you adjust during corner weighting). My concern about using something like the fender lip as a reference point is that if for whatever reason, your left and right sides are not symmetrical, then you could set a gap that looks the same left to right, but might cause weird corner weight problems (i.e. left side is REALLY 1/2" higher than right side if you measure from suspension pickup points which is more work to do).

I have not corner weighted my car yet, but what I have done is use something like the above mentioned methods as a starting point (fender lip) to get it close, THEN I actually measure how far my spring perches have been adjusted and try to make them the same (left to right). I guess my next step would be to corner weight to fine tune.

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Richard Casto
1972 Porsche 914
2013 Honda Fit Sport
2015 Honda Fit EX
http://motorsport.zyyz.com
Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.

Keep in mind though I didn't have to do much adjusting because it was pretty darn close to begin with.

I'm not surprised that Aaron got -3 Deg.

Looking at the dials on my rears on the my '93 Miata, they're at about 1-1/2 marks beyond the "neutral" center mark and that yeilds -2-3/4 degrees.

The fronts are at about the same location, and that yeilds 1.9/2 degrees.
I'm thinking I could get perhaps 3-1/2 on the front and maybe 4-deg. on the rears by rolling the cams over to max out.

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Brad

Brad that seems excessive. Are you running that much or just saying you could get that much. For me 2.5 in front and 2 or less in the rear would seem to be good. Only real way of telling is tire temps after a hard run.

Contrary to the old standard, you are NOT looking for even temps across the tread. You want a "linear" transition from hotest at the outside edge to coolest on the inside edge. Makes sense since the outside edge will be most heavily loaded in turns.

If you want to make measurements let me know and I'll leave my pyrometer (old contact probe style) in the truck's passenger seat.

Its best to not do a cool down lap before taking measurements. Either come in hot at the end of a session (hard to do) or find a buddy who will take temps when you come in after 3 or 4 hot laps.

Ron

You lost me, Ron. Why wouldn't you want to achieve even temps across the tread? Am I understanding correctly that your goal is to get outside edge temps hotter than inside edge? If so, you should expect your result to be more outside edge wear than inside edge wear, which is counterintuitive. I always dial camber in with the goal of achieving even temps across inside to outside edge with temps taken as soon as possible after running hot laps, apparently what you're calling the 'old standard'. Is there some reason you don't want to achieve even temps (= even wear) across each tire's tread surface?

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Keith Q.
2008 Top Gun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmX8XuZ_DCo&NR=1

Keith When you corner the outside edge is the one doing the most work right? So that is the edge that will get the hotest. If you run just straight then with negative camber you are right, the inside edge would get the warmest but we really don't care what the tires are doing in a straight line.

Perhaps the even temps across the tire was with bias ply tires. I really don't know. But with today's radials the correct way to test is for a nice smooth temperature gradient across the face ofthe tire with warmest on the outside. Its not my opinion but rather what I have read and heard in conversations with those that know lots more than me. But it makes sense to me.

R