Help me pick a car

clinehall · **Posted:** Sat Jan 17, 2015 7:54 am

Arthur McDonald wrote:

MikeWhitney wrote:

I drove this one on craigslist today:

Now go read all the articles about electronics problems in early 2000's MBs.

1. Will give Mike a burl wood steering wheel, if you no what I mean.

2. Racing history makes a Silver Mercedes the go to:

Chuck Branscomb · **Posted:** Sat Jan 17, 2015 8:14 am

MikeWhitney wrote:

I drove this one on craigslist today:

I have to say I'm impressed ... The S55 is a lot louder, stiffer, and more responsive than I was expecting. I guess I had set in my head that Mercedes == soft and squishy, but that's not the case here. I didn't get to really beat on it, but the power and responsiveness all seemed to be there. I could tell there was some electronic wizardry going on around the corners with the active rollbars and all. The self-inflating seat bolsters around corners was a trip. Seating position and visibility is nice, and the car felt absolutely well screwed-together. Germans...

I think this car has replaced the 750il on my "gotta own a gigantic expensive overpowered german luxury car" item on my bucket list for the moment.

Now I need to find a good $10k one in black.

PS - I reserve the right to forget all about the Merc and get obsessed with some other car instead at any time lol

I assume the reason these cars are selling in the teens now is related to what Art mentioned? (not just electronics but everything else too perhaps resulting in them falling into hands of people who can afford the entry price but not a $5k repair bill every year).

How was the condition of the car you drove? Issues with it? Anything not working? Accident history? I guess the guy wasn't budging on his price, so you walked?

MikeWhitney · **Joined:** Wed Aug 20, 2003 9:15 pm **Posts:** 4724

Chuck Branscomb wrote:

I assume the reason these cars are selling in the teens now is related to what Art mentioned? (not just electronics but everything else too perhaps resulting in them falling into hands of people who can afford the entry price but not a $5k repair bill every year).

I have to assume it's the scaredy-pants factor of such an expensive and complicated car. There are a couple known issues with these cars, but it seems like by middle-age, most of these problems have cropped up and been fixed. Plenty of reports of people experincing near-zero issues with several years of ownership. Now, with more "stuff" I expect more issues (more problems per year) just based on quantity, not quality.

There's always a risk, so I consider driving a car like this a lot like a track car -- I can "write a check" for it, so if something mechanical goes disastrously wrong, my finances will not be disrupted if I had to dump the car for scrap value. I probably won't even bother insuring it.

I should qualify the scaredy-pants comment ... I think it's actually more reasonable to say that most people are risk averse variable cost of ownership. When someone leases a new Dodge, they know they will pay exactly, say $400 per month. When someone buys a used Honda Odyssey, they know they will get a better car and their cost could be $300 per month if everything goes well, or $600 per month if a car out of warranty gives a lot of problems. The Merc is an extreme of this ... TCO could be $100 per month, or up to $1000 if all hell breaks loose. I think most people can't live with that kind of uncertainty, and their choices reflect it.

Chuck Branscomb wrote:

How was the condition of the car you drove? Issues with it? Anything not working? Accident history? I guess the guy wasn't budging on his price, so you walked?

Car was excellent. Everything worked perfectly and the car looked very nice. No accidents or paint work that I could find. I noticed some driveline vibration that the internet says is failing trans mounts... vibration from 2-3k under moderate acceleration.

KBB if you can believe it for that car in excellent condition is around 10k. I basically told him after a few minutes that his car is out of my price range. He offered $12.5k but I said no. Emailed him later and told him if he wants to drop the price lower in the future to let me know.

Now I'll wait.

Chuck Branscomb · **Posted:** Sat Jan 17, 2015 2:17 pm

That's an amazing car for $12k with original paint, everything working, etc. You want a 192k mile S4 and a 178k mile 850R wagon by chance? :lol:

Package deal. I wish they had made an S55 AMG wagon that would go for that price as I'd buy one in a second for my beater car and ditch the S4 and 850R.

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Sat Jan 17, 2015 4:01 pm

Mike,

From the sandbox Mike Wood in California has this for sale:

Quote:

I've got a 2000 Mercedes S500 for sale...$4000 and I'll deliver it anywhere in the US for gas money

clinehall · **Posted:** Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:10 am

[quote="MikeWhitney"][quote="Chuck Branscomb"]

I probably won't even bother insuring it.
That's ok, I would much rather have a client like you that has multiple liability only cars and knows how to drive as opposed to my normal client who has two cars worth a total of 80K and can't drive. I make about the same and the risk on you is way lower![/i]

I should qualify the scaredy-pants comment ... I think it's actually more reasonable to say that most people are risk averse variable cost of ownership. When someone leases a new Dodge, they know they will pay exactly, say $400 per month. When someone buys a used Honda Odyssey, they know they will get a better car and their cost could be $300 per month if everything goes well, or $600 per month if a car out of warranty gives a lot of problems. The Merc is an extreme of this ... TCO could be $100 per month, or up to $1000 if all hell breaks loose. I think most people can't live with that kind of uncertainty, and their choices reflect it.

Preach it brother. I have lot of people that ask me general financial advice and I try to get this concept to them. If you buy this car for 12.5 and it blows up and burns on the way home you will have lost less than if you bought a brand new almost anything and drove it off the lot. Even if you buy something with great depreciation the difference in purchase tax, property tax, dealer doc fee, higher insurance will eat you alive. Add in the opportunity cost of tying up that much money (either cash or interest) in a depreciating asset and there is your 12.5.

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

I think it's time for Mike to buy a car at auction.

http://content.mecum.com/infonet/email/FL0115-day3.html

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:10 pm

clinehall wrote:

If you buy this car for 12.5 and it blows up and burns on the way home you will have lost less than if you bought a brand new almost anything and drove it off the lot. Even if you buy something with great depreciation the difference in purchase tax, property tax, dealer doc fee, higher insurance will eat you alive. Add in the opportunity cost of tying up that much money (either cash or interest) in a depreciating asset and there is your 12.5.[/i]

But what happens when the $12.5K car blows up on the way home and you need a car to get to work so you can buy food and pay rent, etc. so you buy another one for $12.5K and it also blows up on the way home . . . and so on? :?:

Arthur McDonald · **Joined:** Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:54 am **Posts:** 2052

DickRasmussen wrote:

clinehall wrote:

If you buy this car for 12.5 and it blows up and burns on the way home you will have lost less than if you bought a brand new almost anything and drove it off the lot. Even if you buy something with great depreciation the difference in purchase tax, property tax, dealer doc fee, higher insurance will eat you alive. Add in the opportunity cost of tying up that much money (either cash or interest) in a depreciating asset and there is your 12.5.[/i]

But what happens when the $12.5K car blows up on the way home and you need a car to get to work so you can buy food and pay rent, etc. so you buy another one for $12.5K and it also blows up on the way home . . . and so on? :?:

Then you sign up for a Dave Ramsey course? Greatly depreciated or not, you don't buy a car you can't afford to maintain.

steve remchak · **Posted:** Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:29 pm

One of my regular delivery drivers is always saying how he would love a 7 Series and I continually remind him that while he might buy it for $20K it will break down like a $90K car.

clinehall · **Posted:** Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:48 pm

DickRasmussen wrote:

clinehall wrote:

If you buy this car for 12.5 and it blows up and burns on the way home you will have lost less than if you bought a brand new almost anything and drove it off the lot. Even if you buy something with great depreciation the difference in purchase tax, property tax, dealer doc fee, higher insurance will eat you alive. Add in the opportunity cost of tying up that much money (either cash or interest) in a depreciating asset and there is your 12.5.[/i]

But what happens when the $12.5K car blows up on the way home and you need a car to get to work so you can buy food and pay rent, etc. so you buy another one for $12.5K and it also blows up on the way home . . . and so on? :?:

If one really thinks that is a probability then I guess this lease would make better sense:

http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/special_o ... |e#class=S

Chad Culbertson · **Posted:** Mon Jan 19, 2015 12:21 am

clinehall wrote:

DickRasmussen wrote:

clinehall wrote:

If you buy this car for 12.5 and it blows up and burns on the way home you will have lost less than if you bought a brand new almost anything and drove it off the lot. Even if you buy something with great depreciation the difference in purchase tax, property tax, dealer doc fee, higher insurance will eat you alive. Add in the opportunity cost of tying up that much money (either cash or interest) in a depreciating asset and there is your 12.5.[/i]

But what happens when the $12.5K car blows up on the way home and you need a car to get to work so you can buy food and pay rent, etc. so you buy another one for $12.5K and it also blows up on the way home . . . and so on? :?:

If one really thinks that is a probability then I guess this lease would make better sense:

http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/special_o ... |e#class=S

Wow, those leases are what I pay a month for a fairly nice house with a single car garage and a nice fenced back yard, lol.

Richard Casto · **Posted:** Mon Jan 19, 2015 12:09 pm

So, I now have my very own "new car" scenario going on, but not a fun as Mike's. I was hit on my way home Friday evening I was plowed into while stopped at a light and pushed into a car in front of me. I am fine, but the Fit is likely totaled (airbag deployed, engine mounts broke and pushed back).

I am likely to buy another Fit (3rd gen looks nice) as I need a practical daily driver. I might go and see if I can physically fit into a BRZ, but it is highly unlikely I will buy one for a number of reasons.. Part of my brain was telling me to buy Mike's 93 325i that he has for sale (which is likely a great deal)! But I wouldn't for the reasons Mike gives above. For the car I need to rely upon, I want predictability even if that means more money and less fun.

I need to just finish the 914 to have my "fun" car.

Richard

RodneyWright · **Posted:** Mon Jan 19, 2015 1:19 pm

Richard Casto wrote:

So, I now have my very own "new car" scenario going on, but not a fun as Mike's. I was hit on my way home Friday evening I was plowed into while stopped at a light and pushed into a car in front of me. I am fine, but the Fit is likely totaled (airbag deployed, engine mounts broke and pushed back).

I am likely to buy another Fit (3rd gen looks nice) as I need a practical daily driver. I might go and see if I can physically fit into a BRZ, but it is highly unlikely I will buy one for a number of reasons.. Part of my brain was telling me to buy Mike's 93 325i that he has for sale (which is likely a great deal)! But I wouldn't for the reasons Mike gives above. For the car I need to rely upon, I want predictability even if that means more money and less fun.

I need to just finish the 914 to have my "fun" car.

Richard

Wow... Richard, glad to hear you're ok!! That sucks to get hit and have to buy a new car. That's never fun. I don't think you'll fit in a BRZ, I don't. I'd hold out for a Tesla...

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

I thought the BRZ was roomy enough, just depends on what you are looking for. It definitely is roomier than the MX-5. I had no issues fitting in it with a helmet on even.

No, its not a practical car by any means, but I didn't find it to be cramped.

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