S2000 at HPDE

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

What exactly is required to get an S2000 on the track at one of our track events at VIR?

It would be great if you actually own an S2000 that you do track events with, and could discuss it in detail.

Thanks!

steve remchak · **Posted:** Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:02 pm

by no means official wording but i believe the minimum would be a 4 point roll bar that meets the broomstick test similar to what a Miata must do to be allowed in to a HPDE.

Convertibles
Convertibles must have a roll bar to participate in the HPDE. This is a
requirement of all venues where we currently hold events. Hard top
vehicles do not require roll bars to participate in the HPDE.
5.3.1 Targa or T-Top models are not classified as convertibles and
thus do not require a roll bar.
5.3.2 Convertibles with removable roofs installed are still
convertibles and require a roll bar.
5.3.3 Roll Bars must meet either SCCA Time Trial Rules spec as
defined in the current SCCA TTR. Level 3 or THSCC-TZC
Time Trial Spec. See details in Section 6 of this guide.
5.3.4 Factory installed “head rest braces”, “roll hoops”, or
aftermarket “style bars” do not meet this requirement.
5.3.5 Roll bars must be installed per the requirements in the SCCA
TTR (Time Trial Rules) for Level 3. See details in Section 6.
5.3.6 The roll bar must be padded with SFI 45.1 rated high density
padding in areas where a helmet may contact. Assume 6
inches minimum for seat and/or harness displacement.
5.3.7 Both the driver and passenger must use arm restraints.

RobLupella · **Posted:** Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:35 am

It depends on the club/group. Some allow S2K's with the factory pop ups. I know some of the groups I've run with allow them w/o installing a rollbar.

Check the rules with First Settlers PCA, or Chin.

YoussefGamal · **Joined:** Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:33 pm **Posts:** 21

Kevin Allen wrote:

What exactly is required to get an S2000 on the track at one of our track events at VIR?

It would be great if you actually own an S2000 that you do track events with, and could discuss it in detail.

Thanks!

Roll bar. I know a couple of clubs will let you use the stock s2000 roll bar, but no guarantees.

I know the broomstick test is good, but I have never had anyone really check it and many of my instructors would not have passed it (I am in a miata), so I am not sure I would sweat over that too much.

KendtEklund · **Joined:** Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:29 pm **Posts:** 1204

I know the SCCA chapter that has run HPDE at Rockingham has let a BMW convertible run. There is apparently some pop-up head protection they considered OK.
This was a few years back when I did my first HPDE though.

steve remchak · **Posted:** Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:50 pm

if ya'll read what Kevin asked.....................

"one of our track events at VIR"

this would be a question best directed to the Track Staff i do believe.

RobLupella · **Posted:** Thu Dec 29, 2011 10:05 pm

steve remchak wrote:

if ya'll read what Kevin asked.....................

"one of our track events at VIR"

this would be a question best directed to the Track Staff i do believe.

They are free to answer too. It's amazing that a drunk poster can read better than presumably sober ones.

steve remchak · **Posted:** Thu Dec 29, 2011 10:28 pm

RobLupella wrote:

steve remchak wrote:

if ya'll read what Kevin asked.....................

"one of our track events at VIR"

this would be a question best directed to the Track Staff i do believe.

They are free to answer too. It's amazing that a drunk poster can read better than presumably sober ones.

drunk is relative, comprehension is a learned skill.

Bernie Baake · **Posted:** Fri Dec 30, 2011 9:08 am

Even a blind hog blunders on an acorn every now and then....It not called comprehension....Just blind (in an alcoholic sense) luck.

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

I was hoping that somebody actually has or had an S2000 that they've done track events with, and could give some info on what they had to do to install whatever is needed at VIR. I've heard that VIR has more rules for roadsters than other tracks.

I was also thinking that I might want to do this before April. But I'll probably end up taking the STi again next time, and taking the S2000 later.

Maybe I can discuss it with somebody when we have the officers' meeting?

Stephen Westerfield · **Posted:** Sat Dec 31, 2011 10:25 am

As others have stated, you have to have the 4 point bar to run any of our events. Doesn't matter the track. I'm not 100% sure of VIR's policy, but that is irrelevant when you run with us anyway. I think they are fairly strict about having a bar in the S2000 in particular though.

If you are curious to see a bar installed though, this car has a Hard Dog bar installed in it. When I was shopping for my car, I went and looked at this one and saw a bar in the pictures so I had to go check it out. I was shocked to find that it was actually a Hard Dog. From what I remember, it wasn't the cleanest install, but a pretty good example. Judi and I DID NOT pass the broomstick test in this car with the stock seats. Failed by easily an inch, probably closer to 2". I've heard with sliders and race seats you can make it happen though. I hope so as I plan to try it in a year or so with mine.

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

Well, I'm planning to replace the seat soon, anyway. Stock seat sucks for turning.

JamesMilko · **Posted:** Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:53 pm

Don't forget arm restraints too if you don't have a hard top.

JamesShort · **Posted:** Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:57 pm

I was surprised to hear how mediocre the stock S2000 brakes from a HPDE/TT perspective. Even with good track compound pads and fresh fluid, apparently they fade pretty badly....so bigger rotors and/or ducting seem worthy upgrades.

The 06+ SI has the same rotors/calipers/pads in the front as the S2000 so I thought, wow the SI must have awesome brakes, but then you have to take into consideration the 60/40 weight distribution of the Civic, plus the higher center of gravity etc so the amount of weight transfer (coupled with the amount of static load) makes the SI very hard on the front brakes.

However, with the lower center of gravity, 200 lbs less, and closer to 50/50 weight distribution, I would have imagined the S2000 to do better in the brake department, but seems the front brakes are undersized for the power/weight ratio of the car. This obviously is not an issue with autox.

Bernie Baake · **Posted:** Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:18 pm

I don't really see that power to weight has all that much direct effect on braking. But the higher speeds encountered in HPDE most certainly does. At 55mph a vehicle may present adequate braking.....at 110mph the same car requires that braking system to disapate four times the energy, required to stop it at the original 55mph. So maginal brakes will become appartent at HPDE, where they might be considered good at autox events....

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