THSCC Forums

You have no idea how disappointed I am that you didn't man up and take FTPax in a SS ride at Danville. I mean, it can obviously be done. Look at what Eric did in a lowly AS ride?

Speaking of which, since I didn't take FTPax, this was obviously a horsepower course. End of story.

Since my car (in addition to being underpowered) drives the wrong wheels, I had to feather for rotation as I approached the the first gate on the runway. But like I said, once it was hooked up and I saw daylight, it was



I think courses like these are good for everyone, speeds like this really reinforces a lot of the fundamentals: looking ahead and keeping the car ahead. I was turning in insanely early for elements on the main runway*.

*This may not apply to certain cars, such as nationally prepared AS AP2 S2Ks.

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Not spectacular just decent.
I'm not sure what I'm driving.
Maybe an ITR in DS.
Or half-assed STX prepped 330.

OK, if the former Top Gun says it was a horsepower course, it was a horsepower course. There! Happy? Of course, I did say "former" so what do you know anyway?

How about a compromise? It was a momentum course with a horsepower section???

Jim

Don't worry Jim, I'll get it engraved special for you.

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Not spectacular just decent.
I'm not sure what I'm driving.
Maybe an ITR in DS.
Or half-assed STX prepped 330.

OK - my particular lowly AS car is neither a horsepower car or a momentum car. So where exactly does that leave me, David? Hell. No wonder I can't catch Eric (or Aaron, or Mike) in my own freaking car. Jeez...

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)

Doh! Forget I said anything! Um, please?

Dang, I just admitted I was wrong and said please in the same thread. Forget the Earth-shattering kaboom, I think the universe may soon implode...

Jim

Karl, your car is, put plainly, spectacular.

This asks the broader question of, what's the power to weight ration to qualify a car as a horsepower car?

Certainly, the ZO6. But the S2000? What? 240 HP at 2800 pounds not a horsepower car? More than 50% more power than my car on a good day.

In other words, what should I start shopping for for next year's November event?

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Not spectacular just decent.
I'm not sure what I'm driving.
Maybe an ITR in DS.
Or half-assed STX prepped 330.

This target keeps moving higher and higher it seems too. Back in the early 80's it was any muscle car from before 1972.

Anyway, now we get into what type of power too since a 240hp low torque motor (that revs to 8000 to reach that power level) versus a 240hp turbo motor with a massive torque curve are two totally different animals.

In recent years, I've thought that anything around 10lbs/HP (SAE Net HP) or less was a "horsepower car". Many years ago, that weird David E Davis guy at Car and Driver would claim that any car that could get from 60-90mph as fast or faster than from 0-60mph would be an HP car.

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Current stable:
2019 BMW M2 Competition slicktop 6MT
2011 BMW M3 sedan slicktop 6MT
2007 BMW 328i wagon (slushbox for now)
1975 CanAm 125MX2

Thats a good question and as Chuck states this has evolved some over the years for sure. But currently using lbs/hp I'd say anything under 10 is certainly, I might even push that upwards to 12 while anything under 15 is not horsepower deficient.

If you look at times from this event, Miatas are horsepower cars and Camaros are momentum cars.

Walter --> nlnn

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Has no responsibility whatsoever.

Don't forget that we really had two courses - the taxiway favored smaller, more nimble cars that could handle the tight slaloms. The runway favored power a bit and anybody who could see far enough ahead to pick out the best line. It would have been very interesting to have been able to measure each half and do some kind of breakdown of which cars did best in each section.

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Art McDonald
Premier Amateur #518
2008 Dishman Cup
Pivot Cone Snob

Rodney is a waxer (but in a good way)

From the stock classes, that's easy. SS, AS, BS and FS are what I'd call the "horsepower" cars. Everything else? Momentum car. In AS, the S2000 is kind of a tweener. Certainly not the most powerful AS car in the lineup. But, as Les and I determined, it's got an unusually high "grip to power ratio" as well. Great big Hoosiers plus lightweight equals big smiles.

Once you start looking at ST and SP cars, things change a lot. But I'd still take a swag that your power cars are ASP, BSP, ESP.



http://raleigh.craigslist.org/car/474800479.html
http://raleigh.craigslist.org/car/473515208.html

I'm just sayin'...

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Karl S.
2014 Baby, 2014 House, 2013 Ford Focus ST, 2013 BMW 328i, 1994 Mercedes E320
(Insert passive aggressive signature line here)

Well as I stated before, even the taxiway had a good bit of "power friendliness" mixed in with the tight stuff I'd say at least enough to even things out especially if you "power" car is still reasonably nimble.

I'm late, but yep, that was really fun course. It relit my interest/excitement for autox. If i could have fun in the "funny bunny" then it must have been good!

Thanks!