NCAC PreRegistration II

Wes Eargle · **Joined:** Mon Oct 27, 2003 9:47 am **Posts:** 3683

Anthony Hodges wrote:

I'm sorry to hear of all the ladies participating in the paxed Ladies class instead of running open,only 1 will carry home a first place trophy.

Who would truly want to win a trophy in a class of one, especially at the NCAC level? Wouldn't that be pretty hollow? I have one, a "fastest time prepared" that I went and won on a lark (take THAT Patrice, I can show up and win Prepared whenever you don't show up. Ha!), but I don't sit back and try to claim that it really means anything. Now something like that in CSP? That means something to me, because it's a well populated class.

One of the things that I like about this club *is* all of the fast women, especially those that give the menfolk a run for their money. It's a damn shame that Triad's women are so slow.

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 5:47 am

Wes Eargle wrote:

Who would truly want to win a trophy in a class of one, especially at the NCAC level?

The current enteries are: 3 DSPL, 3 SML, 2 CSL, 2 HSL, 1 FSPL.

edit: To make it more fun, add the fastest lades trophy to the mix based upon PAX. Hell, we have enough money to splurge for the top 3 trophies :-)

Anthony Hodges · **Joined:** Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:53 pm **Posts:** 29

So Triads women are slow ??? My wife regularly places in the Top 15 RAW and PAX,as does Catherine Tegeler in their M3 SM, and as I said I didnt think there was a problem with them pushing for an overall ladies trophy,but there are 2 other clubs that will also be joining the NCAC,each having several women ,as we have, driving cars in faster classes that are not prepared to the limits that CANNOT compete with stock cars in a PAXed class.If you wanted to be fair you cuold do a Ladies Stock,Ladies Street Prepared,Ladies Mod, Ladies Prepared,and Ladies Street Touring.By the way Wes ,when was the Last time you out ran my wife ???And the 1 car in a class thing,,, does this mean that you would like to see all single or 2 car classes bumped to the next fastest Class???

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:21 am

I thought all the club's officiers had sat down and agreed on the format and classes based on an earlier flame. If they have, then there is no reason for a public discussion. The decision was made. If they haven't, then maybe they should. Either way, it should be agreed upon by the clubs and be done with.

Scott Johnson · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:06 am

Anthony Hodges wrote:

I for one was dissapointed to here you will be combining all the Ladies into one class,although our car is prepared near the limits of DSP and will do fair in PAX ,there are many more ladies running in our state whose cars are not prepared as well who will suffer when combined with the Stock cars for the ladies class.The past 2 years CCR and TRiad have honored each class because we felt PAXing the ladies was an unfair advantage to the stock classes.It can be argued that these competitors could have prepared their individual cars better but in reality most dont bother because there is little or no competition in their respective regions.I'm sorry to hear of all the ladies participating,only 1 will carry home a first place trophy.

Historical results don't bear out the claim of a "stock" advantage. Last year's top two finishers would have been DSP cars (by a large margin). Incidentally, those were the fastet PAX and RAW.

It's kind of ironic how for years Tarheel ran individual ladies classes and Triad ran an indexed ladies class. Now it seems to have reversed.

[sarcasm]Of course, we will let a woman run in open class, and not put her in Ladies just because (different folks where running the Triad events back then...).[/sarcasm]

We took a poll of the active women drivers in our club (the ones that qualify for season trophies), and the majority of them said they would rather run a well populated indexed class than run in poorly subscribed individual classes.

How will folks feel if we split the ladies classes apart and then bump them into open class when they don't meet the minimum numbers? Choose your poison.

Scott

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:24 am

scottjohnson wrote:

How will folks feel if we split the ladies classes apart and then bump them into open class when they don't meet the minimum numbers? Choose your poison.

Scott

What minimum numbers are you talking about? For a championship like this, there is no bumping or minimum numbers. Maybe you are getting it confused with contingency money minimum numbers.

This will be the first year that the NCAC does not recognize the L class. There has never been a "LAD" class before for the NCAC. The NCAC should recognize the L classes and if you want to add LAD then fine. Let the ladies decide where they want to run.

Stephen Westerfield · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:28 am

It would be nice to have some of our ladies chime in here with thier opinions....I know one of them already has....

GWEN BAAKE wrote:

Stephen Westerfield wrote:

In regards to classing, we will be honoring all 4 of our normal PAX'd classes, however, only TIR and LAD will be recognized as individual classes eligible for trophy's and "NCAC Club Cup" points.

Thanks guys! As someone who runs in an indexed class, I've REALLY enjoyed pushing myself against fast ladies in fast cars. I know I have to get pretty close in raw time for PAX to kick in. It's a lot more fun than being the only one running in "HSL". Again, Thanks.

Gwen Habenicht · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:31 am

Here's what I've written before. I still feel the same way. I'll add to that by saying to satisfy both sides, offer trophies for each Ladies Class as well as Fastiest time raw AND Fastest time pax. I agree with Jim P. on that.

(In a previous thread I wrote)
Thanks guys! As someone who runs in an indexed class, I've REALLY enjoyed pushing myself against fast ladies in fast cars. I know I have to get pretty close in raw time for PAX to kick in. It's a lot more fun than being the only one running in "HSL". Again, Thanks.
_________________
Involuntary Tree Hugger

Scott Johnson · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:31 am

jimpastorius wrote:

scottjohnson wrote:

How will folks feel if we split the ladies classes apart and then bump them into open class when they don't meet the minimum numbers? Choose your poison.

Scott

What minimum numbers are you talking about? For a championship like this, there is no bumping or minimum numbers. Maybe you are getting it confused with contingency money minimum numbers.

I assure you, there will be some sort of bumping/disqualification for the tally of *club* championship points (the only thing that matters:)). Otherwise, we're all going to need to re-register so we can run uncontested.

Hmm, I think I'll run E-Prepared, and Sally can run E-Prepared Ladies. There's two first place trophies and first place points for Tarheel! Wow, that would be just loads of fun :roll:

Scott

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:37 am

Wow, glad you are not my acountant. If your mind set is on this "club trophy" then you would support the "L" classes. Currently, there are 4 possible "L" classes with more than one driver. So that would be 4 possible trophy points as opposed to maybe 1.

Additionally, you might not want to remove the single L classes from last year's results. Without those THSCC would not have been tied with TSCC :shock:

Jennifer Carter · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 9:16 am

Here's my .02

I'll be running in ladies with a SM PAX. So it seems that I could go one of two ways. We run individual ladies class and I win!

woo! Or we run as a PAX'd class and I get my ass handed to me because I'm not yet competitive enough to go up against the ladies running in the easier PAX, or even raw for that matter.

boo. I honestly don't care what is decided, as I am still learning a lot at every event.

It would be nice to bring something home to my parents, though, so maybe my mom would understand why I missed her birthday last month.

Bernie Baake · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 9:22 am

I hesitate to jump in on this cause I'm still a relative NOOB But here goes anyway. This whole thing seems to be a debate on Pax and how fair it is. AH on one side and everyone else on the other, with Jim P in the middle.
Indexed classes offer more competiton.
individual classes afford more participants to trophy.
Giving an FTD trophy is grossly unfair to the stock classes (Triad gives Ladies FTD)
Giving an FTP Evens this out( Triad does not give FTP for ladies classes)
I believe that to entice more women into this event things have to be evened up, but also must allow for more than one person getting a first place trophy. no easy way to do that!!!!
How about offering both, and let the ladies decide what venue suits them, or run it like a national, or not :whoknows:

I've noticed that most folks who are against pax run in prepared or modified classes those who a pro pax are for the most part in stock classes. It seems next to impossible to find a solution where both preferences are satisfied. I don't believe that forcing one to do the other is the way to go. Either way someone will feel put upon.
I know Gwen likes to compete, She enjoys the Thscc events more than any other because of the competition in the ladies class.
earlier this year she beat Suzanne Doyle in pax at the Triads first event, this past Sunday she was beaten by both Suzanne Hodges and Catherine Tegeler That sounds pretty even to me. But I'm sure it won't to others. The answer to all this is still a mystery I'll leave it to the event chairs to figure out.

jimpastorius · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 9:32 am

Jennifer Carter wrote:

We run individual ladies class and I win!

woo!

You still have two other SML drivers to beat. You beat them straight up and win the class....that would be awesome!

Jennifer Carter · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 9:41 am

jimpastorius wrote:

Jennifer Carter wrote:

We run individual ladies class and I win!

woo!

You still have two other SML drivers to beat. You beat them straight up and win the class....that would be awesome!

haha, I just looked at the entry list and realized that! I thought I was the only one.

Stephen Westerfield · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 9:56 am

jimpastorius wrote:

Additionally, you might not want to remove the single L classes from last year's results. Without those THSCC would not have been tied with TSCC :shock:

Feinberg ran the numbers during NCAC discussions early this year....it doesn't appear it would have mattered how they classed ladies not wanting to run in open...we still would have won. Just wanted to throw that out there.....

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