THSCC Forums

Thanks for the info guys. I saw mention of cheater tires when I joined the club about a year ago but didn't see the original thread that started the debate.

_________________
Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.

And the "cheater tire" topic can segway into the "TIR class" topic which can segway into the "PAX" topic.

The arguments for each are something like this...

Cheater Tire = A "Street Tire" that is not really a "Street Tire".

TIR Class = A "Street Tire" class the causes the open classes to have reduced membership. It relies upon PAX results.

PAX = A handicap system that can't really take into account all of the variables (course design, surface, dry/wet conditions, odd/even day of month, etc.), so it "sucks" and is meaningless.

All are deadhorse topics, but still fun to argue about anyhow.

_________________
Richard Casto
1972 Porsche 914
2013 Honda Fit Sport
2015 Honda Fit EX
http://motorsport.zyyz.com
Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.

I think this is the infamous tire thread that is being referenced:

http://www.thsccforums.com/viewtopic.ph ... highlight=

*rubbing eyes*

_________________
Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.

Well just to get back on topic for a minute before we go down a TIR and PAX and cheater tire rathole any further....

A big thanks to Jim and Rick for putting on an event. As someone who got indoctrinated into the fire last year with a 2-day school/event weekend I can appreciate the effort you guys had to put in. Thank You!

For those of you who haven't been an event chair. They did more than you realize. There are a *lot* of upfront tasks that have to be done long before event weekend. Then run the event. Then get home and hope you don't get a lot of flak for what you did and any mistakes you made. Thanks also to all the usual suspects who do a lot to help the event chairs make the weekend happen.

Regardless of whether I liked the course or not. I would defend the event chairs right to setup *any damn course they want*! One of the few perks of being an event chair is that they get to design the course. As long as it is approved to be safe, meet some overlap times to insure we get 4-5 runs, and can be worked. To me everything else is just plain work and requires time out of *our* busy lives too!

We now return you to off topic discussions:

Get out of TIR class and move to OPEN class.
X is for elitists.
PAX sux.
Azenis are for cheaters.
I hate Subarus and Miatas and rice burners and euro trash cars.
Event chairs, officers and staff aren't nice to me.
The bus hates me! (thanks for trying to kill it for me Ryan)

Hopefully I have now insulted everyone.

Brought to you via a wireless connection I piggy backed, sitting on the deck of the condo, overlooking St. Petes Bay, fairly trashed on Cosmopolitans and any other free liquor I could grab. I take no responsibility for any of my comments that may have offended anyone. Cause I could care less... Time to make another drink. I don't have to work tomorrow like the rest of you

Mr. Vacation Boy

_________________
http://www.greywinds.com

OH there is the Graham we know. Back to his normal curmudgen behavior I know you can't wait to pick up your cheater car just in time for Greenville.

BTW you decided which class you are running that cheater car in?

SS or ASP?

Would somebody that thinks Brian is complaining please quote the part that they are so upset about and that they consider to be such awful complaints? I'm trying to understand what part of his message has resulted in such a backlash.

Miles

Did you read either bullet point 3 or 7 in the first post?

_________________
Has no responsibility whatsoever.

Miles - I don't think anyone thinks Brian is complaining, and I don't think anyone is "upset" about anything, and I don't think anyone thinks that anything he said is "awful".

Not sure where you got that idea.

All I see is someone who had some good ideas/suggestions which (read Scott's post) knocked a chip off of the organizers' shoulder when they were trying to decompress from the weekend. Tempers flared, and suggestions were made back to Brian. Brian tried to sidestep the suggestions for action which is where it got interesting. "Give it but not take it" isn't that well tolerated in this club

Please, people, don't take these kinds of threads to an extreme. Yes, there is a lot of peer pressure in the club - for good reason. That's how people learn how much help is needed to keep the club running smoothly, and it's people like Brian with great ideas who need to be convinced to find a way to swing into action.

OK, that's all I wanted to say for now. I'm sure someone will find a way to misconstrue or take offense at what I have said. But in reality I'm just commenting on how things are. I really don't have any emotions about this topic - All I care about is making sure that the club continues to be as successful as it has been in the past!

_________________
Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

Getting back on topic to explain some things.

Communication of times and penalties last weekend was about as good as we have ever had it.

AFAIK I'm the one who has tried the stickies thing the most often. It works fine at night events, but it has been a major PITA at a regular event unless you're sitting right next to the box.

Someone can't understand how hard that job is until they try it. Maybe there is a better way to do it, but the last time we tried it was even too much work for 2 typical people. Some folks handled it better than others.

I mentioned earlier - someone shoulf grab some warm bodies at the next event and try it out. You'd make a lot of friends.

_________________
Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

Actually, at this past event it would have been impossible. When Mike showed me how to do it at the last Sanford event, I had a seat where I could see the cars in line ready to roll and the timer and had a walkie talkie to hear cone calls. In all, we had no less than eight post-it note pads, and we had to keep track of each of the three cars on course. That and deal with people asking where they hit a cone when they showed up. It ain't easy. at. all.

_________________
Has no responsibility whatsoever.

Honestly, it's better than at a lot of National Tour and Prosolo's I've been to. At the Tours, the master log is the 'bible' in which cone calls are based off of. At the Pros, you're basing everything on blind faith, although they're pretty good about 98% of the time. I had a run at a Pro about a year ago that would have won it for me. Turned out I had a cone, and didn't know it until my very last run. At that point, it was too late. - AB

_________________
'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Mike- thanks for the analysis and clearing this up. I'm so glad that no one is upset with Brian.

Regarding the turns this thread has taken, post event analysis is a good thing. It is how we learn. We need to continue to encourage people to express their opinions on what went well, and what did not about an event.
It is vital to the long term success of any organization- get feedback, analyze, take appropriate action. Back to the topics of event analysis-

Regarding getting times, the radio is a great way for everyone in general to know what's going on with the event. It is an appreciated improvement and I really am thankful to Rob for all the work he's done to improve so many of our electronics. The radio should not be a standalone solution to get times to the drivers though. It certainly won't help cars without radios, and I learned this weekend that may be a higher number than I would have thought.

That being said, Dick and I found that there was a dead spot right after the finish where the radio just flat didn't pick up the signal. I heard several other people say the same thing. Some cars had this trouble, some did not. Maybe my 15 year old radio isn't working at peak efficiency.

We don't need an expensive or high tech solution for this. One simple answer is a worker, at the finish line, with a radio that can get the times and write them down on a sticky- which is handed to the driver. Somebody, possibly the announcer, could call the times out on the handheld radio. He would use a separate frequency that communicates just with the finish worker, so it doesn't interfere with course working.

We've done this at other events in the past, including Sanford and Laurinburg. That may have been what Brian was referring to in his original post when he mentioned sticky notes with exact times on them when we finish.

It works great. The only added cost is a few pads of sticky notes and an ink pen and maybe an extra pair of radios.

Miles

WOW! I now know there are criteria that only certain individuals meet that allow them to offer suggestions and constructive criticism...

Just so we can get onto other more useless discussions then that ALL are welcome to post to, here are my versions of the 3 biggest lies:
1. The check's in the mail.
2. racing gas (or octane booster or snake oil) increased my stock engine's HP.
3. putting in a 160* thermostat made my engine run cooler in the summertime.



I learned I was hated and developed a thick skin about it a long time ago.

_________________
SPIN or WIN!
there's no glory for going slow.