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Breaking even on an event like this past weekend should not even be a concern. This was a beta-event. The club should expect to suffer a little lost to see if the future benefits are there. With sites damn near impossible to get, we should be thankful for every one we have. Ask our friends in VMSC. If we get cocky and think we have these sites by the ba**s we will end up like our friends to the north.

If I remember right (and I do) the initial price tag for the RBC Center was dumb founding. But we went and showed what we could do. Each year the price got lower and that even led to the night series.

Hey, if the Rock wants to charge more, ask for more. We want a clean site and the gates open on time. Free admission to drag racing, etc. We will be shooting ourselves in the foot if we drop Rockingham. As the saying goes, "there is no going back".

If we have to use some of te money from a Laurinburg to support a Greenville or Rockingham or even a future unknown site, we should do it. These relationships are very, very important. These are the only new sites in 3 years and we want to bag them because of cost and "grip"?

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Jim Pastorius
2008 Silverado VortecMax
1992 Camaro CMC#92
2002 BMW R1150R

2009 3rd Place CMC Mid-Atlantic Championship
2009 CMC Hyperfest Winner

Jim Pastorius wrote:



As far as I know, it wasn't a concern. I was simply addressing Tonya's comment earlier that we probably lost money.



Believe me, I am. And I think we as a club do feel that way. I haven't seen anyone get all high and mighty about this. Have you?

Relax Jim.. nobody is throwing any site relationships away.

Miles

To be perfectly honest, I would actually change my vote for 2 G'ville Ax'es to 1 if we went to VMP instead. I had forgot about that site being in the mix.

IMHO, variety is the spice of life, 2 L'burg, 2 Sanford, 1 G'ville, 1 R'ham, 1 VMP, 1 Danville is a GREAT 8 event schedule. I know that may not be able to be worked out due to R'ham and VMP being difficult to schedule.

Just my 2 cents

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02 Focus SVT
STF 9

Are you that clueless? You were a VP before right?

First I never said bag any site, try going back and reading what I actually said. I was providing more information for everyone. That way everyone can actually make an informed decision.

Or we can just keep making assumptions of what people are thinking or are hung up on

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91 Jetta GLI STS/DSP 111
85 Porsche 944 ASP 11
http://www.blackforestindustries.com

I think Greenville is worth at least one visit next year, finances permitting.

I found the grip at Greenville to be a little better than Rockingham, and the tire wear was about the same - minimal. Lateral grip seemed better than Sanford, but I had much more trouble with wheelspin than at Rockingham or Sanford. We should have swept the start area, which was located in the entrance to the lot. (Of course, by the time Patrice, Frank and I got through sweeping water off the course, we were pooped.)

As Miles noted, the rectangular lot should provide a lot more flexibility in course design than Rockingham.

The only downside to Greenville is that 70 mph zone on US 264. With my new cat-back, my car has a terrible exhaust boom/drone between 1700 rpm (68 mph) and 2500 rpm (99.6 mph), and the return trip about wiped me out. Yes, I have gearing/tire diameter spreadsheet.

Art

Sorry Scott but you had to be there to experience the (total lack of) AM grip. On my second run I was sliding around so much and going so slow that I got to the end and started to drive around the building before I first realized I had never shifted into second! I'd rather race on the ice rink at RBC than to run there for more than giggles. I was on the back side of the building when the first cars started to come back and wondered why everyone in the cars were laughing hysterically, I soon found out! Yes the grip got better in the afternoon but that's a relative assessment, Sanford has more grip in the morning. Sorry, I'm not interested in driving 2 hours to make two competitive (?) runs on such a tiny space. With all the oil there I'd never run tires I care about using again, especially in the summer.
What's the problem with Danville it's closer to Raleigh than Greenville or Rockingham, Triad doesn't seem to be interested in using it, getting dates shouldn't be a problem, it's wide enough for course variations, with the wireless timing equipment we can use the taxiway without a pivot cone, the surface is grippy without being abrasive.

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SPIN or WIN!
there's no glory for going slow.

Art,

I suspect that, assuming you were on R tires, that part of the start line problem was lack of temp. Also, the start pavement wasn't sealed and the course was. I expected that the rougher looking start pavement would actually have more grip but it didn't work out that way for me. I was surprised about the lateral grip on course, especially since the accel grip seemed so poor through the whole run. Braking grip was good also (after the first couple of runs). FYI for you guys "analyzing" stuff, my car has about 114 flywheel HP and Torque, weighs 1100 lbs, has an open diff, and I ran the course in a 68 mph gear so most corners were exited around 3K. Oh, and its length and width are about the same as a Miata (93 inch wheelbase and 68 inch overall width).

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Dick Rasmussen

FS 50 2018 Mustang GT

I believe we're going to end the year about $3000 down from where we were at the enf of last year. And this year we got paid for EV challenge in 2003 and 2004, AND had Viper Club. Call it about a $4k-5k shortfall. I have been on this soapbox before - even with the member fee increases *I* predict some problems next year. Many other people don't seem to agree with me though.

So, yeah, in my opinion we need to be sensitive about all of our costs, site fees included, since we're not raising entry fees next year.

Our "average" site fee increase and insurance cost increases over the last few years probably accounts for about 1/2 of the shortfall. Bus maintenance and decreased attendance accounts for most of the rest.

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Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

Man, I am SO voting for you for autocross VP. That sounds perfect

Just make the G'ville event an evening event so we can try something new and you'll be my hero

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Mike Whitney
whit32@gmail.com, 919-454-5445
V10, V8, V8t, I6, I6, V6, F4t, I4, I4, I4, I4, I2, 1, 1

The problem is, your information was incorrect. Therefore, people can not make informed decisions.

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Jim Pastorius
2008 Silverado VortecMax
1992 Camaro CMC#92
2002 BMW R1150R

2009 3rd Place CMC Mid-Atlantic Championship
2009 CMC Hyperfest Winner

Actually no it wasn't.

Miles was wrong with his comments about the RBC. I have the 03 and 04 finances right in front of me as far as the RBC costs

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91 Jetta GLI STS/DSP 111
85 Porsche 944 ASP 11
http://www.blackforestindustries.com

I voted 1 event there. Like I said in the other thread. Limit the entry count, raise the price, and do a day/night event there. No points, just for fun so we can get this site on our schedule.

I'm not seeing how using outside of the fence to pit 80-120 cars is going to fit. We sure couldn't use the area for grid that we used last weekend for 80-120 cars. It was tight with only 55 entries. Other than that I don't see a real problem with the site.

We all have favorite sites and ones we don't like. Keeping them all for at least 1 event keeps our options and relationship with the site owners open.

Oh and on the finance issue. Well I'm with Rob and it sounds like Mike too. For 2005 I would have raised entry fees by $5 instead of membership fees.

Graham

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http://www.greywinds.com

Adam, I don't know what you're looking at, but let's take this up offline. I'll email you some specifics and see if we can get our facts straight. In case you forgot, I'm not on the sidelines of this discussion. The site fees are, for better or worse, the results of negotiations I had with the site owners. Next time, just call me if you have questions or you think my numbers are all wrong.

Miles

Perhaps we can save some money by getting rid of frivolous costs like special insurance for club officers ...

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Has no responsibility whatsoever.

Or perhaps you'd like to be an officer w/o any.

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)