THSCC Forums

I think that Rob's suggestion to have "cool badges" is a good one. It would easily identify several people that are a "novice resource" for all the random questions that newbies can have so that the novice would not have to track down his "assigned" helper if he just has a quick question like "do I work report for work now?" or "which line do I grid in".

Just for some conjecture -- I do find having identifing marks on members to help -- HOWEVER, what if they are all working/running and I am lost/confused? What do I do then?

Maybe this is my first event, and I don't know where these 'designated' NOVICE helpers are, and I am intimidated by the 'scene'.

Maybe I got a late start to the event and I didn't realize all that goes along with autoX when you get there, and I missed the drivers meeting and NOVICE instructor introduction.

What, as a NOVICE do I do? If I ask someone, I may or may not be pointed in the right direction. However, pointing to a CENTRAL LOCATION -- like a tent or whatnot -- would be easy for ANY member to get a newbie some help quickly.


However, the buttons do allow for very minor/quick questions to be answered by the button-wearer. There would just have to be many button wearers (which shouldn't everyone technically be a 'button wearer').

I think the 'button' just makes it a hit or miss as far as finding these people unless their work assignement for that heat is the NOVICE location. However, I am assuming there would be more questions in the morning, and less as the event goes on.


Just my two cents. Any help would be good. Just trying to point out some pros/cons.

- brian

Did I hear someone mention buttons?

How about this for a first shot?



We could also give Wes this one.


Just kidding Wes

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George Bright Member # 141
One of the youngest of the old farts.
Yes I voted against you joining the club.

This subject has been discussed in another thread as a possible program for next year. There were some very good ideas. Over the winter we need to consolidate it and bring it into play next year.

Miles and I had a very aggressive schedule planned for the weekend and in our enthusiasm probably pushed an idea for Sunday that caught some folks by surprise. My apologies for that part. Overall I think getting those Novices paired up that morning helped keep the flow of the event moving better. There were quite a few Novices to work with. We just didn't handle it the best way.

We also have some good Novice documemtation on our website that discusses a lot about their first event and what they should bring and be prepared for. It doesn't appear to be getting much mileage as most Novices seem to have no idea it is there. Maybe just better broadcasting this message before the school that they are expected to read it. They won't understand all of it but at least will know some basic things they should show up with and an overview of what happens during an event.

We can't just dump all of this on the Novice Coordinators. It has to be a group effort that is more than the adhoc thing that it is today.

By the same token it can't be the same people all the time. We're just going to burn them out. As noted you do not have to be a PRO class driver to help a Novice understand the basics. Anyone with a years experience should know the drill and can answer many basic questions. We all, as members, should have the responsibility.

Graham

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Outstanding, we need new blood to step up to help out! Please take my comments below as constructive.



I think alot of this information is given during the registration process but is mostly ignored. Most of the time its on the course map, we didnt have one this weekend due to the OVERWHELMING amount of stuff on Miles and Graham's plate to get together for the weekend. Even still, its often ignored.

Like what was said earlier in this thread, there are PLENTY of resources on the net for novices, thats what I did when I showed up at my first autox, I printed out the information from the web. Was is still clueless? HELL YEAH!! but I survived.



There were 22 novices registered for this past weekend, the spit between group 1 and group 2 was pretty close, 12 Group 1 vs 10 Group 2. So, we would have needed roughly 5 or 6 helpers PER HEAT. For some sites that may work, but we were thin on workers as it was with 12 worker stations, this would only make that worse. That would also involve those 5 or 6 helpers to basically be working or running all day. Not very good for them, they have things to do too.



We already allow this, I told each of my students from Saturday if they ever saw me getting ready to run to ask if they can catch a ride. I generally dont like riders in the afternoons but am pretty much a pushover.



Its on the net, there has to some sort of preparation for the entrant to do. Plus, I dont know how much SCCA would like us to be printing their rule book and distributing it.



We have numbers and tape at the registration table now.



Who is gonna maintian them? What happens when someone takes off with the air gauge? Where do we store them? Who pays for them?



Simon has 1 helper to do 110-130 cars. I dont see how he can do much more.



I agree, what we did with the novices was, in general theory, a good thing. It just needs more refining, which is in the works. I dont however think that for $20 someone should expect to show up and be catered to for the whole day. Its just impossible for the amount of volunteer work it would involve.

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I expect an apolgy from the secretary in next month's heel and toe

But seriously, at one of the meetings we need to establish a working group that is dedicated to the novice issues. They could implement a plan or leave things as status quo.

I am all in favor for making a THSCC event novice friendly. I have been preaching this for years. I have not been doing this long enough to forget my first experience. If it was not for Diane and Mike Dishman, I would have been more lost. Like Ryan, I did print off and study the autocross hints for novices.

One easy task, would be for the novice coordinators to send an email to the novices, ointing them to documents to review and memorize.

The novice walk-thru should not focus on driving, rather on course safety and responsibilities. Telling a novice to brake early, early apex, yada yada on their walk-thru is futile.

Okay, time to get radical...eliminate the walk around tech. Implement a drive up tech. This will allow a more intimate meeting with a novice. 99% of the time there is no driver at the car when tech comes by. You could have one line for annual tech. Drive through and get your sticker

I do like the button or hat idea...those volunteers would be there to answer questions and possibly ride along. That is their work assignment.

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Jim Pastorius
2008 Silverado VortecMax
1992 Camaro CMC#92
2002 BMW R1150R

2009 3rd Place CMC Mid-Atlantic Championship
2009 CMC Hyperfest Winner

I'm with Jim on both of these. Not that the roaming tech is a bad idea at all; I think it's rather convenient for me personally but I'm willing to give up a few minutes of dealing with a more traditional tech procedure for the cause. (The 2 line idea is definitely a good one!)

I had a friend that has been autoxing for years show up on Sunday and when he asked where Tech was and I told him that he just needed to open the hood and he would be found, he looked at me as if I had told him we had little gnomes running around that go in an invisible group to get into the car and tech it for you and then the magic sticker would appear on the windshield.

I also like the idea of a "Novice Helper" worker assignment. Perhaps just 1 per heat and they can have a big chef's hat or button on or something like that? Just kind of wander around grid and paddock area to help. Help novices with the loaner helmets, find someone to ride along, etc.

The Novice helper as a work assignment won't work. We often barely have enough workers to cover the course and timing let alone have extra's for this. Unless you can find people willing to work twice, good luck with that

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I knew the worker nazi would jump on this Point well taken. How many novice coordinators do we have per event? What do they actually do?

Pull the novice coordinator away from the registration table and put them in grid for a heat. They can answer questions, make sure helmets are available, ride along and if needed seek ride along for a confused novice....

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Jim Pastorius
2008 Silverado VortecMax
1992 Camaro CMC#92
2002 BMW R1150R

2009 3rd Place CMC Mid-Atlantic Championship
2009 CMC Hyperfest Winner

Usually a few per event. They do little things like hang out and make sure people know their class before they get on the bus and stare at the registrar with a blank look when asked what class they are in. They also run a novice meeting before the event and answer general event questions. It is an important job, even if the only thing they did was keep the registration line moving properly. It's hard to be registrar when you have to also do all the classing, etc.

Scott

I was going to make this suggestion too. As one of the novice co-ordinators, we end up making sure everybody (not just novices) get a worker assignment, hand out numbers, and do other relatively low-value for novice stuff. It would be worse if Ann the honorary Novice co-ordinator, paypal registrar was not there We then try to get the novices to come to the Novice meeting and go over safety issues, cone rules, general stuff.

What I also do, and I see Vince doing it is actively try to hunt out the novices and give them suggestions, rides, etc to help them improve and feel welcome.

I would offer to work with Vince (if we are both Novice Coordinators.) to work on a proposal for a more fully functional Novice program next year. We can look at the suggestions from this thread and stuff we have learned and see if it meets with the officer's approval.

These could include:
-Buttons for AX'ers that are willing to ride with/give rides to/help novices (My idea and I still like it )
-A segregated Novice area that is just for novices
-Year-long Novice class
-Other stuff that we think of

Ouch! I don't know about about Rob or Frank, but I don't do anything.

Seriously the three of us rotate at the novice table (so we can each get course walks) getting newbies classed and making sure they know when to work and when to run. Ann also helps a lot and for that she has my vote for Heel Of The Year. Thanks Ann!

About 30 mins before the driver's meeting we hold a novice meeting and go over the cone rule, DNFs, working, SAFETY, grid, etc. We also do a course walk at pretty much every site except LB. It just takes too long at that venue.

This year I have been sending an e-mail to everyone signed up in NOV that contains an attachment covering the basics. It's very helpful, but I can't make 'em read it unfortunately.

I think all three of us go out of our way to get newbies ride alongs, and answer questions to make them feel more comfortable. If anyone thinks I'm not doing my job then vote me out of office. I'll warn ya the pay sucks.

I think Miles' idea needs a bit of polishing, but is definitely a good one. I must have ridden in 6 different cars on Sunday. I think I helped all of those people in one way or another which was well worth my time.

The reward in teaching is seeing that light come on in your student's head. BTW, Mitch's light is now on so I'm not teaching him anymore. That is unless he offers me another co-drive in the Boxster.

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Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)

I can't help but chuckle at the fact that a very similar discussion is going on right now in NER/SCCA Solo II.

I look forward to seeing how you think ideas work down there, and I'll let you know if we seem to hit on something brilliant up here.

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Diane (Hall) Bundas
1992 Spec Miata #48 - 1997 Chevy Tahoe - 2007 Honda Civic Coupe

Thanks again Vincent. I really learned at lot about how much the car can do.

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Mitch Moore

We had a couple car prep issues so we didn't make the drivers meeting Sun. (many apologies) but we had a couple people that remembered us from Saturday's school come up and ask if they could course walk with us and we did ride alongs both ways for several people. Donna and I are always willing to help out novices or even experienced drivers almost anytime. We do like to make one or two of our afternoon runs alone, but we will ride with others on any of their runs. We did receive a couple of thank yous after the event, which went a long ways towards making us proud that we had volunteered.
I suggested this before, but I'll mention it again, that I think that we should make it a requirement that a novice take an experienced driver with them for X number of events (3 would be my thought).

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