THSCC Forums

Ouch man. That's sort of a bummer to hear considering the energy, time off work & away from family life, and fuel we've used recently in our perpetual 'new site quest' to make the Jimmy V happen somewhere other than Laurinburg.

Humble advice to future VP's: Don't make a poll even it you want to mix it up and get some feedback.

Speaking of tradition, we did this format in '10 at Sanford and it seemed to be a hit. 75 entries on Saturday for the 'fun' day (several people were driving different cars and mood was layed back and fun) then on Sunday the course was tweaked a bit and we saw 119 for the typical Sunday Points Event/Jimmy V Fundraiser. http://thscc.com/autocross/events/index.php?season=2010

At this point I'll run split groups, Saturday points event, Sunday points event, it really doesn't matter. I'm just anxious to see how the site is and bring in a few dollars for charity.

Forgive me Matt but I don't understand the "problem" that is created by both days potentially counting as a points event.

I'm not trying to tear down anyone's considerable efforts of volunteerism, and I don't understand how that is always thrown at me whenever I offer a suggestion.

By offering the option of points for both days you accomadate more people in my opinion. Again, I don't see the crisis here ......... too much pressure to be on your A-Game for both days?

I have no dog in this fight, I am merely offering an opposing opinion from a distance. A distance which I believe most of our AutoX participants sit at anyway. There is a fine line between obsession and hobby, obsession tends to create tunnel vision.

I'm out before I get accused of stirring up shit again. Hopefully, The Kid and I will see Ya'll for one of these two dates.

Peace Out Yohe

_________________
BenchWarmer Motorsports

another one of those damn LeMons heads

just another Chump

we are an Autocross Club Dammit............

I promise it's not like that, especially in the STR grid. We're jumping out asking each other what we ran between runs, geeking it up with swaybar talk, trading Go-Pro cameras and it's pretty laid back. We (THSCC auto-x in general) seem to be more grassroots than ever with only a few national tour/championship participants versus 6-8 years ago, but I'm sure the economy plays a little part too as attendance is down everywhere.

Wasn't trying to single you out, but hope you can make it to try out the new lot one or both days!

I don't know what the world is coming to but I agree with Remchak. SMH

I would love to see a 2 day points event where we run two different courses and combined times. If people want to run one day then they can but it gives those of us who plan to be there both days something extra to look forward to.

_________________
Professional Student
2006 MINI Cooper S JCW

No, that is not at all what I was trying to say, that is probably the worst choice IMO. I'm simply saying that for the best inclusion to accommodate the most people we have, Saturday, Sunday or both count towards points for a single event result. My initial recommendation for this was the same course both days, this is the easiest way to achieve this goal, however I do understand the reluctance to running the same course both days regardless of my personal opinion on the matter. You earlier suggested a way to have Saturday, Sunday, or both days count toward a single event using a delta formula, this would be very challenging to calculate final results (though we have enough software engineers floating about the club, surely someone could write a script for it) but could potentially work toward serving both goals of better inclusion and having a two different courses on each day.

_________________
'07, '08, '11 Autocross VP
'06, '10 Mike Dishman Cup
'21 MX5, '13 Corvette GS, '92 Corvette 383 c.i. 413whp/390wtq, '03 Expedition

Seriously, I'm not trying to belittle in any way the effort here by the VPs in getting new sites, the fact that we have picked up two potential new sites in one year totally kicks ass. I understand the frustration and thankless nature of being a VP, I've been there a few times myself.

Do to the nature of this event, having only either Saturday or Sunday being a points event has its downsides and will screw over some group of people, to solve this I'm suggesting that a flexible plan that allows people to run only one of either day or both and be a competitor in a single event for the weekend should at the very least be an option in the poll. As stated before, the "easy button" to achieve this is to run the same course both days, but this approach also has its downsides particularly for those with short attention spans.

_________________
'07, '08, '11 Autocross VP
'06, '10 Mike Dishman Cup
'21 MX5, '13 Corvette GS, '92 Corvette 383 c.i. 413whp/390wtq, '03 Expedition

The schedule has been in flux all year long due to new sites and losing old sites. The fact that we have kept it the same weekend is a win in my mind, let alone worrying about what day people get "screwed" into having to miss for season points. We don't give people the option of running Saturday OR Sunday for any other events, so why is this different? The fact that we are holding another "non points" event that weekend should really be independent. A points event where entrants potentially get 10 runs at the same course is sort of changing the sport IMO. When we ran the two day format last year, a LOT of participants actually got slower the second day anyways. The reality is, our points system is already accomodating of people who may not be able to make it to all the events. Thats why your worst result is thrown out. I think a side benefit of two different courses is to try out some different setups on the new lot. I'd like to gather data as soon as possible on which of these lots we like better to understand for future events. I'd like to see a total change in course, not just a tweak or reverse, but I'll leave that to the people who are actually running this event. I'm willing to offer my manual labor in course setup to help make that happen.

As a side note, the fact Steve you accused Matt of "tunnel vision" is absolutely comical. There is nobody in this club more interested in getting feedback from as many sources as possible. For the record, my recommendation was that we just declare "this is how the Jimmy V is going to be run", and that since he is the GM, it was his call. Instead, he wanted the poll to gather input.

_________________
2012 MX-5 Sport SUV

I agree, and IMO running an event "by committee" is not a good idea. All our GM's do a thankless job, and try to accomodate most people, but sometimes you (as VP/GM) just need to make the call. I trust they will make the right call as they do 99.5% of the time.

_________________
Vincent Keene
'06 Ford Mustang GT (track rat)
'15 Dodge Charger R/T (yeah, it's got a HEMI!)
'07 Ford Fusion SE (205,000 miles and counting)
'98 Chevy Z-24 (retired)
'93 Acura Integra (Team SWB 24HOL Car)

^^^^agree. The more course design concepts we can try out in the shortest time, the better, especially with a new site. I hadn't recognized that before, but that is an important point. Too bad we can't have one event in North lot and one in East!

Just because you ask for feedback via poll doesn't mean you are mandated to do what the poll results say...you are just soliciting observations/opinions/preferences that may help uncover aspects and issues you hadn't previously identified.

FWIW, I voted you guys as VPs because you know how to make good decisions and you put a good face on the club (as evidenced by two new sites this year). I am confident the weekend will go smoothly and will be a great new site for our club in future years.

_________________
Steve Carter
1972 Datsun 240Z-- resto pics at http://picasaweb.google.com/srcartermd
2007 GPW Honda S2000-- STR 86

I thought that was in the instruction manual


We have almost always kept the same course for both days, seems like a good reason to change it up and use a different course both days. Try something new, hell we might even like it

_________________
02 Focus SVT
STF 9

Actually Brice ....... tunnel-vision was more directed toward you and James if you must know. Seeing how all Ya'll's avatars look alike anymore sometimes I get confused.

_________________
BenchWarmer Motorsports

another one of those damn LeMons heads

just another Chump

we are an Autocross Club Dammit............

I agree with Brice and Vincent. Just do what you prefer with the event. Given the Auto-X VP's past record of fine events, I'm sure the event will be great. If it fits in with your schedule great, if not, were sorry please come to the next event.

If someone complains about what you did after the fact, listen carefully and then apply the Shawn Whipple patented THSCC opinion weighting system.

Bowie Gray = 10x
Current president and VP's = 5x
Other current officers = 3x (5x if the complaint relates to their area of expertise)
Regular event attendees = 2x
Casual event attendees = 1x
Knobs on the internet who never attend events = I'd say print it out and use to line a bird cage but that would just be a waste of paper.

_________________
OK so I'm back in. Now which tire should I buy??

and so it begins........................

_________________
BenchWarmer Motorsports

another one of those damn LeMons heads

just another Chump

we are an Autocross Club Dammit............

You forgot

Past Officers = -10x

_________________
02 Focus SVT
STF 9

Damn, what a mess.

No one said that points can't count for both days, the only definitive is that we want different courses each day. If there are suggestions on how to make both days count for points (mine was the only suggestion so far which little to no feedback....I could write a Ruby script to do those calculations in 10 minutes...hell, excel would do it in a few moments). Does it sound clunky? Yes, sure but the whole idea is to make as many people happy as possible while still allowing 2 difference courses. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Remchak, don't call Brice out like that, you know I'm the dickhead VP, keep things focused .

So where are the other suggestions on how to make 2 different courses work for points for both days while pissing off the least number of people.

_________________
2011/2012 Autox VP
2013/2014.5 President
2013 Top Gun

2015 Fit

22R-EC => 4G63 => D16Y7 + D16Y8 => EJ255 + K24Z2 => K20Z3 + K24Z2 => K24Z2 + M54 => L15B