STR in 2012

Keith Vail · **Posted:** Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:55 pm

Zach Hill wrote:

Well, this was brought up so I want to know. If I were to replace the AP1 bumper bar with an OEM, unmodified AP2 bar (which would presumably fit under the AP2 bumper cover), would that be legal under the update/backdate rules?

I agree it's pretty ridiculous to say the small bit of metal shaved off gives an unfair competitive advantage, but I just want to know for the sake of knowing.

Not that it matters for local stuff but per the rules it would not be legal to replace the AP1 bumper bar for an AP2 if it is different in any way. I am sure there is no performance advantage and I wouldn't care if you did it if I was running in STR but technically it isn't legal per SCCA rules.

Steven Carter · **Posted:** Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:00 am

I bet if you wrote to the SCCA STAC they would say it's illegal, mostly because of the "shave to fit" part. Maybe you can prove the AP2 bumper/cover supercedes the AP1 via Honda TSB? :whoknows:

+1 on no local protest, though. A bumper cover doesn't make you faster. Given the Nationals shenanigans over protests I would bet otherwise if you went to a Tour event.

Ryan Holton · **Posted:** Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:48 am

Steven Carter wrote:

I bet if you wrote to the SCCA STAC they would say it's illegal, mostly because of the "shave to fit" part. Maybe you can prove the AP2 bumper/cover supercedes the AP1 via Honda TSB? :whoknows:

+1 on no local protest, though. A bumper cover doesn't make you faster. Given the Nationals shenanigans over protests I would bet otherwise if you went to a Tour event.

Save the letter, you can get the whole story here from the guy who wrote the rule

http://www.roadraceautox.com/showthread ... post988401

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

It's amazing the difference the 30mm front bar and the UK spec alignment made. :shock:

It's a completely different car now.

The alignment was pretty screwed up - camber was almost zero, same with toe (front and rear). Every time I turned a corner and gave it a decent amount of throttle, I'd be instantly countersteering, even after putting the star specs on. It was pretty tough to control sometimes, with the VTEC lag limiting the tire spin.

With the big bar and alignment by Janko, it feels great - the amount of drift and level of control is about the same as a stock STi, and it doesn't dart around like it did before with these tires. I was a little worried about how much I was going to have to tip-toe around the course on Sunday, especially after driving the STi to work yesterday and seeing how much better it devours country roads than the S2000 did, but I'm not worried about that now. :thumbsup:

MarcusMcRae · **Posted:** Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:05 pm

Kevin Allen wrote:

It's amazing the difference the 30mm front bar and the UK spec alignment made. :shock:

It's a completely different car now.

The alignment was pretty screwed up - camber was almost zero, same with toe (front and rear). Every time I turned a corner and gave it a decent amount of throttle, I'd be instantly countersteering, even after putting the star specs on. It was pretty tough to control sometimes, with the VTEC lag limiting the tire spin.

With the big bar and alignment by Janko, it feels great - the amount of drift and level of control is about the same as a stock STi, and it doesn't dart around like it did before with these tires. I was a little worried about how much I was going to have to tip-toe around the course on Sunday, especially after driving the STi to work yesterday and seeing how much better it devours country roads than the S2000 did, but I'm not worried about that now. :thumbsup:

A bigger front bar really does help. It will make it understeer more in slower corners though.

What alignment specs did you use? I am currently using -2.0 front and rear with 0 toe front and 1/8in total toe rear.

MarcusMcRae · **Posted:** Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:41 am

So I googled UK spec alignment. That said -1.5 for the front. Why didn't you max the camber in the front? You should be able to get -2.0 easy.

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

Because I'll be doing one autox in the next few months, and a lot of driving straight, and I figure camber isn't going to be that important when I'm countersteering.

I still haven't made it understeer yet, but I'm used to the STi, where you really have to either slow down or handbrake it into turns. So I've been using the slow in/ oversteer out technique. It will be interesting to see what happens when I'm doing more than one or two hard turns in a row, and actually trying to get through them quickly instead of just having fun.

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

Also, the UK alignment I saw said -1 degree in front, -2 rear, zero toe front, and a little toe-in rear.

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:01 pm

...Just for you Kevin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IFFSytA38o

@ 1:02-1:15

Have fun tomorrow up in Danville y'all!

MarcusMcRae · **Posted:** Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:21 pm

Matt McGrain wrote:

...Just for you Kevin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IFFSytA38o

@ 1:02-1:15

Have fun tomorrow up in Danville y'all!

Bleah. It's ugly and too 'spensive.

Tomorrow should be fun! Bummer you have to work Matt:(.

Carlton Whitehead · **Posted:** Sun Dec 11, 2011 1:20 pm

Considering the noises I've been making about running STR in 2012, I've been conspicuously absent from this thread. Some of you might have heard I was thinking about selling my Altima. It seemed to me it's been needing too much maintenance lately, and now it's threatening to cut into my S2000 STR prep funds with the latest round of issues (exhaust midpipe and AC compressor need replaced). I went through the motions of getting it appraised for sale this last week, but it doesn't look like I would get much for it, considering its history. Going through those motions made me feel like I was about to break off a relationship for no good reason. As screwed up as that may sound, the bottom line is I'm way too attached to it, so selling it is off the table. That means I need to spend the money to fix it, so there goes my STR prep fund.

That's not to say that I won't run STR in 2012, though. Maybe I'll pull a Noah and run several different classes this year, especially if someone offers me a codrive.

Or maybe I'll run my bone stock S2000 in STR just to see if I get thrashed as badly as I did at NCAC this year.

Or maybe the efforts I'm making to reduce other expenses will let me replenish my STR fund. That probably wouldn't come to pass earlier than mid-season though. Those so inclined have plenty of time to offer me a codrive!

Steven Carter · **Posted:** Sun Dec 11, 2011 7:50 pm

Sorry to hear about that, Carlton. Here's an idea: DD the Altima as a 3-season car and drive the S2000 in the summer (assuming it has working AC.) Fix the exhaust issue and save the AC repair for later!

Can you DIY the exhaust fix with parts from Jeremy?

Kevin Allen · **Joined:** Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:42 pm **Posts:** 3479

Just get a bigger front bar for less than $200 and keep a set of Dunlops or whatever on it. There's your STR prep.

As for today, that was a totally different experience than I'm used to. :lol:

I could definitely get used to this crazy drivetrain that forces two wheels to do the work that four are supposed to do, though. It's funny how certain things just don't work the same, and you don't really think about it being a problem until it happens, and you go, "WTF?" Like when I first tried to back the car up to get the front tires on 2X6 boards so I could jack up the front end by the subframe. I just put the boards behind the wheels, put it in reverse and then started spinning the tires. Realized I have to get a running start to make it happen. :lol:

Kinda the same with some of the things I was experimenting with today. Most of them didn't work too well for going fast. :thumbsdown:

But most of them were fun. :thumbsup:

Zach Hill · **Posted:** Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:08 pm

Carlton Whitehead wrote:

Considering the noises I've been making about running STR in 2012, I've been conspicuously absent from this thread. Some of you might have heard I was thinking about selling my Altima. It seemed to me it's been needing too much maintenance lately, and now it's threatening to cut into my S2000 STR prep funds with the latest round of issues (exhaust midpipe and AC compressor need replaced). I went through the motions of getting it appraised for sale this last week, but it doesn't look like I would get much for it, considering its history.

Appraised? If you took it to a dealer, they probably told you something like "well, with the aftermarket stuff and exhaust issue, it really reduces the value... blah blah blah." I think you should throw it on craigslist for a price you'd be willing to take, and see what the response is. I think for a younger-ish person, maybe their first or second car, they'd love to buy that thing, and see the aftermarket stuff as a plus. I don't think you'd have much to lose by doing so, I mean how long does it take to snap a few pictures and write the posting?

If you can't or still don't want to sell it, then I agree with Steven that you should postpone the AC repairs until next summer, and DD the S2000 when necessary. Didn't you just buy a second set of wheels anyway? Race tires and DD tires... done! ;-)

As for STR prep, honestly I think a big front bar and cheap coilovers would be all you need to be competitive. Remember, my shocks are 4+ years old and cost less than $1k new...

Jeremy Ellison · **Joined:** Fri May 13, 2011 5:01 pm **Posts:** 186

Zach Hill wrote:

Carlton Whitehead wrote:

Considering the noises I've been making about running STR in 2012, I've been conspicuously absent from this thread. Some of you might have heard I was thinking about selling my Altima. It seemed to me it's been needing too much maintenance lately, and now it's threatening to cut into my S2000 STR prep funds with the latest round of issues (exhaust midpipe and AC compressor need replaced). I went through the motions of getting it appraised for sale this last week, but it doesn't look like I would get much for it, considering its history.

Appraised? If you took it to a dealer, they probably told you something like "well, with the aftermarket stuff and exhaust issue, it really reduces the value... blah blah blah." I think you should throw it on craigslist for a price you'd be willing to take, and see what the response is. I think for a younger-ish person, maybe their first or second car, they'd love to buy that thing, and see the aftermarket stuff as a plus. I don't think you'd have much to lose by doing so, I mean how long does it take to snap a few pictures and write the posting?

If you can't or still don't want to sell it, then I agree with Steven that you should postpone the AC repairs until next summer, and DD the S2000 when necessary. Didn't you just buy a second set of wheels anyway? Race tires and DD tires... done! ;-)

As for STR prep, honestly I think a big front bar and cheap coilovers would be all you need to be competitive. Remember, my shocks are 4+ years old and cost less than $1k new...

I thought coilovers were a must too until yesterday. James sure showed me though...

+1 on craigslist, you didn't take it to CarMax, did you? I'd KBB it ask for at least the private party sale price. Just make sure to get a bill of sale.

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