THSCC Forums

Yes that is certainly the case with those two cars having the same numbers and both *SP cars...this is probably a relatively rare corner case. I tried to word my comments lightly, but the point being is that, without a doubt, radio people on course are going to get trigger happy and communicate a call too fast. This will happen no matter how much we emphasize how to use the radios. So my only point being is if we are going to loose SOME info in a VERY small percentage of cases, then I think class is probably the least important piece of data in the cone call string. Basically what I'm saying it's the least of numerous evils. Obviously we want to here all 3 strings of data, and the chances that two cars running one after the other with the same numbers is quite small so in general it should be a non-issue.

Or we can institute that 2 cars can't have the same numbers regardless of class and yet still require them to call in <class> <number> <cone call> and the class would just act as a radio button buffer for those who always speak too soon.

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2011/2012 Autox VP
2013/2014.5 President
2013 Top Gun

2015 Fit

22R-EC => 4G63 => D16Y7 + D16Y8 => EJ255 + K24Z2 => K20Z3 + K24Z2 => K24Z2 + M54 => L15B

First, thanks to Gwen for the co-drive and apologies for turning it into the Cooperdoriftomobile. That's not really the fast way, so in hindsight, maybe it was for the best that the datalogging didn't work out.

Fun course. But, to be fair, it takes a lot for me not to have fun when I'm driving. I'd have had more fun if that cone didn't appear on my fast run. It's a bit of bummer to hear a run went a certain way, then see the results are different.

Not to pile on, but yeah. 40+ seconds should never be the overlap. No matter how many people are registered. It's just rolling the dice with something we can control and design around. We can totally run 160 people through quickly.

A couple thoughts on course working: I was working heat three. I'm not sure who was working two, but he was either talking too soon or his radio was starting to give up the ghost. Aside from equipment issues, a couple of things you can do if you're working the radio to make things work better.

1. Let the car clear your section / area of responsibility before you make the call. That stops you from immediately calling in an update over the copy coming back from the bus.

2. Call things in the same way every time. It makes for routine which is a good thing. Out of habit, I always (try) to call in this way: "This is Station X, +Y or DNF, on Class Number." I know we don't log which corner, but if nothing else it takes out the issue of radio delay or jumping the gun. And it gives T&S a chance to switch mental gears to recording a penalty.

That way when something unusual does happen, it gets the special attention it deserves. "OMG. There's a car on fire!" or "Is this work shift over yet?" or "Can we pay our membership online yet?"

Nice to knock some rust off on a Sunday in Sanford.

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Not spectacular just decent.
I'm not sure what I'm driving.
Maybe an ITR in DS.
Or half-assed STX prepped 330.

WC issues noted. New policies to be implemented....more later.

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Steve Carter
1972 Datsun 240Z-- resto pics at http://picasaweb.google.com/srcartermd
2007 GPW Honda S2000-- STR 86

3. Push Radio button, PAUSE, then speak.

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02 Focus SVT
STF 9

To me, the station that called it is pretty irrelevant since I don't record it. Its just extra radio chatter. Although maybe I will start. Like you David, I had mysterious cones show up on my fast run (FWIW I watched your fast run and didn't see any cones). I'm pretty sure its our AX VP sabotaging things to get FTP.

With regard to launch interval for T&S, I'd rather have it be a hectic, short work shift than a long boring one anyday. Shorten it up as much as you can, to me the limiting factor should be how quickly the workers can run and reset the cones. If we have to hold start every once in a while to catch up, so be it, but thats better than guaranteeing that it will be a long session.

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2012 MX-5 Sport SUV

You'd fit right in at an SCCA event then. The launch interval's pretty quick.

I was discussing the lack of anyone knowing or understanding how we run events on sunday. We have most of this info on the home page with instructions on numbers, work requierment and the like.

We should have a terms and conditions requirement for pre-reg. that lists all of our extra edu. stuff we have on the home page that says, "I have read the above info and agree to be ridiculed and ostricized if I don't get it right." At least it would require them to look at it.

And please stop the music.

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Silver Honda
Green Ford
Blue/White Suzuki
Red Triumph
Grey BMW

"Never let life be shaped by fear of its end"

No, you're a towel!

I disagree with this. I like to know what my time was because there are times when I am way off and then know that I have to pick it up and even when not off I benefit from being able to use times as baselines so I can think about where I need to cut time. I can live with that overhead. ( I think Graham thinks entry fees will be cut if he can eliminate positions and then he won't have to pay people so much to work for him)

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1990 Faded Reddish CSP Lite Miata
2002 Electron Blue Corvette Z06
2005 Mazda 6 Wagon
2003 Nissan Pathfinder DTV (Dog Transport Vehicle)

Uhhh - yeah, that would be me. I couldn't believe I had a DNF - until I went back to the video tape. Duhh! I eventually figured it out. BTW, this was my first AutoX in 8yrs. I had a great time and had plenty of social time to catch up with old friends!

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09 Bullitt - DD
11 Fusion - Wife's DD
03 Mazda6 - Track car
00 PSD Excursion - Tow rig
67 Firebird - Don't you still own your 1st car?
61 F100 - Dad's truck
90 Moto Guzzi Calif III - Tourer
00 Cagiva - Adventure bike
00 DRZ400 - Woods bike

A few additional notes.

Comment about porta johns and parking at the bus. There should have been at least 3 porta johns if not 4. 2 down near the pits and 1-2 up on the side of grid. There is no reason for parking next to the bus, period. It's been abused by many special people over the years. Just put an end to it.

The radios. Whoever is in charge of them. Some seem worn out. There were a couple that were randomly breaking up and/or just flat out not working well at all. They need to be tested. Ryans comment about Push to Talk, then PAUSE, is dead on. I remembered that after hitting the button a couple of times. Those walkie talkies have lag. We need to remind people of this all the time. It seems easy to forget.

As far as "senior" or "stewards" at worker stations goes. That is in place. There is a station Lead. However, education is more important. When 35 Novices show up. And then add in a good smattering of people who have maybe a couple of events who don't count as Novice drivers, but are still Novice course workers. You will always have some station on some shift manned with noobies. Just help them out with the basic ideas. You can't do it all in the Novice meeting. We tried, we'd have been there all morning. It has to be ongoing. Remember that all the people who really know AX inside out are also the ones trying to get the easiest jobs, ie, anything but course working...

On the getting your times thing. I agree you should get them. I don't agree we need to make up more job positions to do it. What is the point of having that big display, for T&S or Drivers? Doesn't T&S get the time on the computer in the bus? Then put that big display down near finish. Forget the stickies. Unless the display dies that us more cost and overkill. More crap to litter the site. You can be assured you'll find them scattered about. Less overhead people, not more.

I still think given first event of the year, a surprisingly high turnout, making an extra long day. It still ran very well. Yeah you can improve on it. But don't beat yourselves up over it. Good job folks!

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http://www.greywinds.com

To Graham's point about the display, what ever happened to an announcer and the fm radio transmitter? If I knew I could un-mute my radio after coming across the line to get my time, that would work perfectly. - AB

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'14 Toyota Sequoia Platinum 4WD
Super Westerfield Bros - '93 Integra - LeChump Du Jour
STX 93 - Scion FR-S

Its a technical issue AFAIK. I honestly don't know if the data line can be that long.



Well said.

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02 Focus SVT
STF 9

Some of us don't have (working) radios

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One of those LeMonHeads...
91/95 Miata, 02 Focus SVT, 01 Ford F250, 09 Suzuki SV650SF
rusty 84 C4 Vette, tiny piece of the General Lei
Irish Sport Horse - 1hp NA!

Quick note on grid when I ran it in group 3: I think the only issue I came across was the large group and long overlap causing people to get nervous about whether they'd missed their run, and there weren't many of those. I have a system that keep everything smooth, organized, and consistent so that by run 2 everyone knows exactly what to expect (that's important). One-driver in A / two-driver in B is perfect for a balanced and smooth grid operation in an all-at-once event.

The way I run a grid like that is...

First time through, I identify a car in line A that's easy to pick out, roughly halfway, and with the driver hanging out near it. I'll be telling that driver I'll be pulling A and break before I get to him to run line B, so he doesn't get geared up just for me to walk to the other side. In this case, it was the red Z3. I use the same car each time for consistency, and so pick someone who doesn't look too much like a flake. It's much more important to be able to pick it out easily than to be exactly halfway -- anywhere in the middle 1/3 is fine.

I finish off the group I've taken over from the previous grid worker, then start the new group at the far end of Line A first.

Then I go into the routine, which is the same for each pass:

• As I approach the bus end of a line, I make sure there's enough cars lined up to cover my walk to the other end of the line I'll be pulling from next.
• On the way back up I remind (tell first time) the "break" driver I'll do B before him.
• I finish the walk up to the far end of line A. I do this part of the walk briskly and in the middle of the road so I stand out as the person with the clipboard coming up to send cars.
• I pull cars from the far end of A and stop before the red Z3.
• I move to line B, pulling from the far end until line B is done, stacking the line a little at the end to allow time to walk back to the right place in line A.
• I go back and pull line A from the red Z3 to the end.
• When I hit the end of the line A, I go back and pull B again, stacking cars to allow for the walk.
• This second time through B, the line has to be stacked a little more because I'm going to be moving all the way to the far end of line A.

B line gets two runs for each A run, so everyone should finish run 4 on the same pass.

There are inevitable people who aren't ready when I get there. If they're at the car and just haven't geared up yet I mark them off and tell them to go when they're ready, and I keep walking. If no-one's at the car, I just walk on by and pull the next -- when they eventuallly realize it, they'll come find me, and I tell them to get their car and pull up by me so I can mark them off and feed them in when ready. The line sometimes runs a little long this way but it never runs short of cars, and no-one misses their run.

My ideal start line never gets shorter than 3 cars to allow a buffer in case I have to deal with an issue on grid. I generally shoot for one on the line and 3-4 waiting -- ideally the next car arrives as the one on the line launches, but I'm not *that* good. Places where I can't really see the grid line well (like at the far end of A on Sunday) I try to time my sending a car with one completing the course to keep the line consistent. Greenville is the hardest, can't run the line long there and can't see it well; Danville is usually the easiest to see and keep at the right length.

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Martyn Wheeler
AXing Kit's '05 Mazda 3, #29 HStock
(when The Gonzo Symphonic allows)

Once I figured out what was left from 3 and straitened all that out, this is exactly how I finished the day sending car's down and I had no need for a 2nd grid worker (mentioned earlier). I thought this method was faily efficient.