R-comps that will last a whole season

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

So I think we're going to make the plunge on some R-comps for my wife's mini. Problem is, we can REALLY only afford one set for the year (considering she has to run 17" R-comps to be CS legal, so we're gonna be buying a new set of wheels also). We plan on running all the Tarheel events, and maybe 3 or 4 other events. Any chance theres one that will last her the whole season (w/ two events at Laurinburg)?

Its a camber challenged strut car unfortunately, I'm curious how reasonable this is. I'm sure we'll need to flip them part way through the season to even have a chance. I'd like to get her as competitive of a tire as I can, but if we burn them up, she's on runflats for the rest of the year unless she gets a job (which is up in the air a little bit). I hear good things about the BFG R1's, thats probably what we're leaning towards, but I'm always interested to hear advice from others. . .

Ryan Holton · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:42 am

What size 17?

My initial reaction is not Hoosiers. The good ole' Victoracer V700 seem to last forever and are still available in 225/17's, the V710's will last a long time too and are faster. Both are considerably cheaper than the R1's

I hate to see her leave STX

Aaron Buckley · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:06 am

I would think that you will need six total, if you buy anything but Hoosiers. The V710 would actually be the best choice. The V700 wasn't all that great for limited camber cars.

My reasoning for the quantity would be the events at Laurinburg. The place eats tires (the grip is very good), and unless you have good experience with r compounds (not overdriving them, correct pressures), the wear for the first set tends to be a bit higher.

Buy 4 initially and continue to run the same rears on the car all year, flip the fronts mid way through and then you will need to replace the fronts again. The Mini is just too camber limited to expect better than that. - AB

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:27 am

FYI,

Miles Beam and I corded at least one Victoracer from wear (not camber challenge) in less than a season on his C4 Vette. Replaced it with a used tire from somewhere . . . no grip

.

Having to "conserve" tires, for any reason, really puts a damper on enjoying the sport. You pass on fun runs, worry about any driving error, drive "easy" in high wear situations, etc. (been there done that). Ditto for running good tires which have "aged out". The financial stress of R-comps may just not be worth it for you at present.

If the goal is lots of high quality seat time, a set of proven long lasting ST level tires might be a better choice. Then you both can drive hard all year and just see how many R-comp drivers you beat anyway.

Dick

Jason Mauldin · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:44 am

Buy 4 tires, run 2 at a time on the front only.

DickRasmussen · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 12:07 pm

Jason Mauldin wrote:

Buy 4 tires, run 2 at a time on the front only. Learn how to control oversteer and/or never trust the rear of a car:lol:

Fixed that for you. :lol:

Jason Mauldin · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 12:46 pm

Hey, I'm just giving him some options.

Gwen Habenicht · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 1:12 pm

Brice, my vote would be V710’s, as much as you can stuff on a proper rim, and not rub. I’ve had very good success with them the past few years. I’ve had much better tire wear after my first Evo (now Solo Pro) school when I stopped pushing and spinning the right front as much. (Yeah, yeah, I know…still a bit of a tire spin Queen. :oops:

) I always try to put the best two on front, and when they get into the wear bars move them to the back. So, I’d say, start with 4, but you may need 6 rims and 6 tires by the end of the season, just to keep the rotation going. Flip them when they start to look really warn on the outside edge-then only expect to get about 3 events out of them if they’re on the front. The good news is that the rear takes very little beating, so you’ll get good use of the two that holds the back of the car up.

Just remember that a lot of how they wear is in how they're driven. And, air pressure.

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

this all sounds pretty expensive though, STX is sounding better and better to me

Thanks for all your advice, I'm anxious to make the plunge at some point, its just figuring our whether or not we can really afford it thats the issue.

Just to clarify, I'll still be running my 3 in ST, ready to kick Lee's butt so I don't need them to last the whole season with two drivers, just one.

Keith Vail · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 4:07 pm

As was stated, I don't think you will be able to make a set of 4 R-comps last a full season on the Mini. It shouldn't be a problem with 6 tires but that sounds like it is out of your budget or at least a stretch.

The V710s would be the only way to go for you IMO if you do end up with R-comps. Hoosiers do not take well to camber challenged front heavy cars such as the Mini.

JamesShort · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 4:15 pm

When you guys say 'camber' challenged cars are you referring to the fact that vehicle has (absolute value) not too much negative camber nor is it adjustable enough? Or does this mean a front strut suspension with less than ideal dynamic camber curves?

So r comps will wear out faster on a 'camber challenged' car due to sliding a lot from less than ideal lateral grip? Is this the point?

Keith Vail · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 4:21 pm

JamesShort wrote:

When you guys say 'camber' challenged cars are you referring to the fact that vehicle has (absolute value) not too much negative camber nor is it adjustable enough? Or does this mean a front strut suspension with less than ideal dynamic camber curves?

So r comps will wear out faster on a 'camber challenged' car due to sliding a lot from less than ideal lateral grip? Is this the point?

All tires will wear the shoulder out faster on a car with not much negative camber in an autocross setting. A strut suspension with little to no negative camber will shred the outside shoulder in fairly short order in most cases. A car like the Mini that has struts, only about -1 degree of camber and all of its weight between the front wheels will go through tires quickly.

My S2000 is very well balanced with the engine completely behind the front axle line, it has double wishbone suspension and -2 degrees of camber up front. I corded a pair of Hoosiers in under 70 runs this past year. They were worn evenly across the entire tread surface right down to the cords. My old Crossfire had -1.8 degrees of camber and a multi-link suspension and it shredded the front tires, I corded a pair of Hoosiers in under 25 runs and they had been flipped on the rim.

A Mini will get no better than 30 or so runs from Hoosiers and I would imagine no better than 70-80 runs on V710s. IMHO

Matt McGrain · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 4:33 pm

JamesShort wrote:

When you guys say 'camber' challenged cars are you referring to the fact that vehicle has (absolute value) not too much negative camber nor is it adjustable enough? Or does this mean a front strut suspension with less than ideal dynamic camber curves?

Not to speak on Brice's behalf, but I'd venture to say that the camber is what eats/cords the outer edge of the tire.

If Mary is running the car with no co-driver (I think you made it clear you're going to stick with the Mazda) I don't see why she can't eek out 75 runs if you get the tires swapped L to R at about 35 runs to alleviate the wear on the outer shoulder.

Personally, I had a great experience with a few sets of V710's, they were 15" albeit, but they were run on my ITR (stock sway & old shocks) and one set actually lasted two seasons. I didn't do every event but I'm sure I got about 75 runs and the R is not exactly camber friendly. However, the Integra is a little lighter at 2600 lbs so that's something to keep in mind.

I had a set of Hoosier A4's when they were in production and had them flipped on the wheels to save the edges around 35 runs and only got about 15 more runs out of them thereafter, fwiw...

I'd say get a set of V710's and call it a day. Let me know if you score a good deal b/c I'll be looking for some 235-40-17's for my Si.

JamesShort · **Posted:** Fri Jan 22, 2010 4:34 pm

Keith Vail wrote:

JamesShort wrote:

When you guys say 'camber' challenged cars are you referring to the fact that vehicle has (absolute value) not too much negative camber nor is it adjustable enough? Or does this mean a front strut suspension with less than ideal dynamic camber curves?

So r comps will wear out faster on a 'camber challenged' car due to sliding a lot from less than ideal lateral grip? Is this the point?

All tires will wear the shoulder out faster on a car with not much negative camber in an autocross setting. A strut suspension with little to no negative camber will shred the outside shoulder in fairly short order in most cases. A car like the Mini that has struts, only about -1 degree of camber and all of its weight between the front wheels will go through tires quickly.

My S2000 is very well balanced with the engine completely behind the front axle line, it has double wishbone suspension and -2 degrees of camber up front. I corded a pair of Hoosiers in under 70 runs this past year. They were worn evenly across the entire tread surface right down to the cords. My old Crossfire had -1.8 degrees of camber and a multi-link suspension and it shredded the front tires, I corded a pair of Hoosiers in under 25 runs and they had been flipped on the rim.

A Mini will get no better than 30 or so runs from Hoosiers and I would imagine no better than 70-80 runs on V710s. IMHO

Got it thanks, just checking if I was following.

So it is about dynamic camber curve of the front strut suspension causing it to roll into positive (less negative) camber territory if the static negative camber is not much. Wouldn't a nice stiff front ARB not help mitigate (to an extent) the dynamic camber curve during roll so the outsides don't get eaten alive.

That reminds me that I need to get an alignment (OEM on the WRX is -.17 deg (ie 10 minutes) in the front but it is adjustable to about -1.25 deg) before the season starts. It's not much but better than OEM

.

BriceJohnson · **Joined:** Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:33 am **Posts:** 2230

well, the R isn't that much lighter (maybe ~100 lbs), but a double wishbone, so it has camber gain on suspension compression, unlike a strut

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R-comps that will last a whole season

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